Bulbapedia talk:Project Pokédex/Archive 4

Archives

• Archive 1 (discussions from March 14, 2005–August 26, 2006)
• Archive 2 (discussions from October 7, 2006–May 19, 2007)
• Archive 3 (discussions from May 25, 2007–April 19, 2012)

About the Leader

Will this project have a leader? --Alexsummer 03:18, 18 August 2012 (UTC)

As Project Pokedex is central to the entire wiki, the project is too important for a leader. It is overseen by the Editorial Board. Adyniz — Wanna talk? 03:25, 18 August 2012 (UTC)

Sugimori Ken's Artwork

I think it was a good idea to replace the FireRed/LeafGreen artworks to the Red/Blue artworks (in the case of Generation I Pokémon). So I was thinking about you guys placing a section on every Pokémon to put Sugimori Ken's atwork of every game they appeared. Sorry if it looks too pushy XD. PS¹: I call Sugimori Ken because it's the Japanese way to say his name. PS²: I'm Brazilian, so sorry if my English is a little (or too) bad.--Deruffy (talk) 21:16, 1 September 2012 (UTC)

PokémonInfobox - Artwork/Image size?

I'm new to Bulbapedia, so I apologize if this is addressed elsewhere, but anyway...

Someone in the Talk:Karrablast_(Pokémon) page pointed out that Karrablast's image seems a bit big. Out of curiosity, I checked a few other pages and noticed some inconsistency in the size of the Sugimori art on the Pokémon pages; e.g., Karrablast (200x308), Shelmet (180x168), Accelgor (180x162), and Escavalier (200x244) -- Should the larger images be scaled down to 180px? Is there a standard already for this? Thanks. -- GranoblasticMan (talk) 17:02, 14 November 2012 (UTC)

Xerneas and Yveatal

Is anyone going to create these pages? Just revealed at http://www.pokemon.com/pokemonxy/en-us/ - unsigned comment from Plusleminun311312 (talk • contribs)

Game data location

Why is "Game data" below "In the anime/manga/TCG/TFG" sections? All of those are based on the games. Other articles always have their "In the games" section before their "In the anime/manga/TCG/TFG" sections. This is without commenting on the comparative usefulness of "Game data" sections to the users browsing this site. Yvnr (talk) 13:35, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

Biology section problems

The Biology sections are all too free-form as of now. I think this can be changed by sourcing every line of information included in them, through the use of cite notes. This would rid the sections of baseless information, and make clear when information is exclusive to portrayals in the anime (or other non-main series game sources), which is appropriate given the large difference between the sources. Yvnr (talk) 13:35, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

This Tynamo article edit is an example of what I have in mind. Its implications on this particular article's previous/current content are small, but it will serve to prevent future additions of baseless information, while organizing where the information comes from. What can be achieved through such sourcing should be clear if you imagine its application to a Biology section like that of the Ivysaur article. Given the nature of Bulbapedia's Biology sections, which I'd argue differ significantly from other site content in terms of what gets past the radar, I think sourcing is in place. Thoughts? Yvnr (talk) 15:02, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

Speaking as someone who has been repeatedly vexed by wondering whether new accounts are making things up or adding legitimate info from anime/manga/side games that I haven't seen/read/played, I think this is a fantastic idea, and fully endorse it. (As a side note -- and not to disrupt the main point of discussion or steal its spotlight -- it might also be nice to implement citations for cases in which a primary source such as a game or movie is not yet available to the public, especially when the info is not easily accessible in English; see, for example, my confusion about New Tork City on the talk page for Genesect Army. But that's a suggestion for somewhere else, not Project Pokedex.) Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 06:34, 19 April 2013 (UTC)

I definitely agree with having this. --It's Funktastic~!_{話してください} 13:54, 19 April 2013 (UTC)

Judging by the August 14 Message from the Editor, it appears we're done here. Yvnr (talk) 13:22, 15 August 2013 (UTC)

External links to strategy pages

Every species article has an external link, or several, in its top infobox, to its web page(s) at smogon.com. Assuming that this is (A) desired, and (B) done for the game data information (Abilities, base stats, moves learned) included on those pages, and not for the strategic advice (this is an encyclopedia) it is linking directly to, I suggest adding a "/moves" at the end of the smogon.com URLs included in the templates named "Template:Links/<number of generation>". This would link to a page with all the game data information, and game data information only, instead of a page with only some of the game data and a whole lot of strategic advice. I do not have permission to edit these template pages myself. There's also the issue of the links to strategy pages awkwardly cluttering up the "External links" sections of articles such as Deoxys's and Rotom's - why have these? Yvnr (talk) 09:56, 25 June 2013 (UTC)

I disagree here. The point of linking to Smogon is that as an encyclopedia we don't provide strategic advice, but Smogon does. As we are affiliated with Smogon to some extent, we're also supporting their site. I don't see the point in linking to the moves page on Smogon over the general strategy page, as we already provide the moves info; the purpose of the link is to provide additional information we don't and shouldn't as an encyclopedia. As for Deoxys and Rotom, I think it would be better to put all the external links in the infobox with the others. --SnorlaxMonster 10:04, 25 June 2013 (UTC)

Then assumption B was completely off. I didn't think this was the intention, nor was I aware of any affiliation - care to explain it? As for your reservation towards linking for the sake of (mirroring) game data information, I thought this was a plausible explanation (at least more than strategic advice) since that's essentially what Bulbapedia does with its external links to sites such as veekun.com and legendarypokemon.net. Maybe I'm misunderstanding some overall crediting process/affiliation due to being unaware of how Bulbapedia editors other than myself obtain the information they add to articles of species, moves, Abilities, etc. Anyway, the statement "The point of linking to Smogon is that as an encyclopedia we don't provide strategic advice, but Smogon does." is empty without explaining why an encyclopedia needs anything to do with strategic advice in the first place. Sure, a reader may want strategic advice about the Pokémon whose article they're reading, but they may also wish to discuss/look at fan-made drawings of/read fiction about/eat cookies shaped like/etc. that Pokémon; all of which are services Bulbapedia doesn't link to sites that provide. As for Deoxys and Rotom (along with Wormadam, Giratina and Shaymin), I have now brought this up and can do little more than hope others will fix it. Yvnr (talk) 11:06, 25 June 2013 (UTC)

Well, recently the Bulbapedia Twitter put out a question asking people what they wanted from Bulbapedia, and one of the things they specified was that they wanted competitive information. As an encyclopedia we can't really provide that, but Smogon is considered the go-to site for that, and the link allows people to obtain competitive information without Bulbapedia having to worry about subjective content (Smogon does all the worrying about that). Veekun has information that Bulbapedia does not always necessarily have (particularly cries and the "Ridiculously detailed breakdown" of locations). As for the nature of our affiliation with Smogon... I'm not entirely sure about that myself; affiliation has always been messy, and there is currently an effort to clean it up. There were plans to remove LegendaryPokemon.net links altogether. --SnorlaxMonster 13:17, 25 June 2013 (UTC)

Want to join

Can I join Project Pokédex? I could help on the Generation II Pokémon. --Supermarti15 (talk) 23:48, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Just add your name to the list. Crystal Talian 23:48, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

where is the list to sign up?--Zygarde&! (talk) 17:02, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

Here. Just edit that and add your name. --Wynd Fox 17:35, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

Mega Evolutions

As the games are knocking at our door already, we must think about the Mega Evolutions. If we're going to keep only the standard pokémon pages and add the Mega info at them, the infoboxes will be a little problem, easily solved by creating the templates "Mega Types" (typem) and "Mega Ability" (abilitym). But my opinion is that we create new pages for every new Mega Evolution and put the links in the first line of the Standard Pokémon, with some statement visible at far ("This pokémon goes Mega", with the link placed in the term "Mega", or "This pokémon goes Mega: Mega?????", with the link placed in the Mega??????, 'coz Mewtwo already have 2 Mega forms, so we could list the forms and put a link for each one). What do all of you think? --Subzerobrasil 06:49, 29 September 2013 (UTC)

First of all, new comments go on the bottom. Second, the staff are already working on this. Third, no. Mega-Evolved Pokemon will not be getting their own pages. They are not new Pokemon and as such, don't need them. Ataro (talk) 07:08, 29 September 2013 (UTC)

Type Effectiveness

It still says to use the DP type effectiveness. Obviously, this should be XY. I don't know the policy for editing Project pages, though, so I'm leaving it alone. --Wynd Fox 06:38, 30 October 2013 (UTC)

Pokemon-Amie

I was thinking, maybe we should add Pokemon-Amie data to the pages, such as where a species likes and dislikes to be petted. Should we? Zaffre (talk) 20:52, 10 November 2013 (UTC)

I know you've already seen it, as you've posted in it, but for anyone else, there is also an ongoing discussion at Talk:Pokémon-Amie → Pokémon Preference. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 21:00, 10 November 2013 (UTC)

Pokémon with changed base stats

I think there should be a category for any Pokémon whose stats changed in Gen VI. Anyone agree? --Wynd Fox 22:44, 11 November 2013 (UTC)

I agree, not that me agreeing has any authority. You have my vote, though; I think it's a great idea. Eliza (Musicgirl) 22:20, 29 June 2014 (UTC)

Pronunciations

I have discussed the topic of adding pronunciations to the Bulbapedia Pokedex, and have received negative(not mean just not fond of the idea) feedback from the Administrator User:Force Fire. I understand that it seems almost impossible to do this, considering that there are many conflicting Pokemon name pronunciations within the anime, but by using official licensed Nintendo Pokedex books with pronunciations like: "The Official Pokemon Handbook" from 1998 concerning the original 151+Togepi, and by acknowledging the most common pronunciations(that word is in here a lot...) from the multiple anime series, I believe that it could be accomplished from joint efforts from Bulbapedia members. If any Admins or members don't like this idea or love it, please respond in this post. -WilliWonka. 03:54, 27 February 2014 (UTC)

There used to be a section like that in the infobox template, but it was removed. Remnants of that are still on certain pages. Pikachu Bros. (talk) 03:58, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

Like I said in our email conversation, there are conflicting pronunciation between the official guidebooks. And many other people also have conflicting opinions on how a Pokémon's name is pronounced.--ForceFire 04:01, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

I guess it would be extremly difficult ForceFire, I just think that it would be useful and a fresh addition to the Pokedex. But I won't overstay my welcome. Remember, if you or another Admin warm up to the idea, just contact me and I can start up a project. :D -WilliWonka. 04:11, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

Hongkongian names

There are two things I really hope to point out.

1. The Hongkongian names are supposed to be accurate. But the Romanization is not standardized. Sometimes it is using diacritics and sometimes completely non-notated with any accent. I really want to know if I am allowed to join up and fix them with consistent standards. There are at least 4 standards: Yale Diacritic, IPA Diacritic, Jyutping with numbers and plain letters. If we take Bulbasaur as an example, the 4 different notations are respectively:
   1. Yale: Kèijizúngzí
   2. IPA: K̖eijìzǔngzĭ
   3. Numberings: Kei4 Ji6 Zung2 Zi2
   4. Plain letters: Keijizungzi
   5. In Bulbapedia now: Gēiyihjungjí
2. When the first generation of the Pokémon was out, Hong Kong was still under the British rule (year of handover: 1997). Instead of the red flag with a strange ventilating fan, we used the Blue flag with Union Jack and the Coat of Arms for Hong Kong. [1] I think if we change all the flags pertaining to Hong Kong back to this blue flag, it will be more correct historically. It should apply to the First Generation only.

-Iosue (talk) 17:14, 2 May 2014 (UTC)

Trainer ownership

Can we list the opponent trainers that have the Pokémon? For example, Rattata was used by Youngster Joey on Route 30 in Gold, Silver, Crystal, HeartGold and SoulSilver. Can we have some trainer table listing the trainers that used the Pokémon? I'll make a User:SeanWheeler/Trainer use in my userspace. SeanWheeler (talk) 15:20, 17 May 2014 (UTC)

Out of date...

I'm not sure if I should edit this project page, or how much, but the Pokemon infobox and availability examples in the infoboxes section appear to be out of date. The Pokemon infobox code even includes a pronunciation parameter... Tiddlywinks (talk) 01:06, 15 June 2014 (UTC)

Sprite Sections

I want to help with the sprite sections on new Pokémon. How do I find sprite pictures to add to the chart and how do I add them in? At this point I'm just practicing using the preview button (without saving), but I'd like to eventually add a full section. Can anyone offer me some advice?

Thank you in advanced to anyone who has a tip for me! -Eliza (Musicgirl) 22:21, 29 June 2014 (UTC)

Serebii's Info

Serebii has info about the new 6th gen. legendaries (Volcanion, Hoopa) that we don't have. Are we legally, or by Bulbapedia's rules, allowed to add it here? I would gladly create new pages for the Pokémon and their moves.

~Zaffre~ 17:43, 8 August 2014 (UTC)

Information must never be taken from Serebii. He doesn't like it, and we must respect that. I believe that we are also waiting for official confirmation before their pages are created. Werdnae (talk) 05:11, 12 August 2014 (UTC)

Pokémon Cries

While browsing about the Web, I noticed that PokéWiki (the German equivalent of Bulbapedia), which is a part of "Encyclopædiæ Pokémonis", has Pokemon cries in their Pokédex. I thought it was a great feature and an important part of each Pokémon species. My question is: Can something like that be done here? And if so: Can we use the cries from PokéWiki?

FoggyMoor (talk) 02:01, 13 August 2014 (UTC)

This has been brought up before, the main reason why we don't have the cries is because it kinda screwed with the server. Though that was then, not sure if the server can handle it today. It's just something that was just put off and consequently forgotten.--ForceFire 03:19, 13 August 2014 (UTC)

Updating Artwork

I have some High Resolution artwork on my computer for some of the Pokémon from the 5th Generation, I was wandering if i could update them, of course, i would need permission. Also, do the artworks have to be 1280 x 1280 pixels? Moonboy65 (talk) 23:48, 13 December 2014 (UTC)

Full List of 1280 x 1280 artwork i actually have on my PC (the list will gradually get bigger):Bulbasaur, Charmander, Squirtle, Pidgey, Jigglypuff, Psyduck, Golduck, Growlithe. Arcanine, Gengar, Lapras, Mew, Marill, Sneasel, Lotad, Nuzleaf, Ralts, Kirlia, Whismur, Azurill, Sableye, Meditite, Plusle, Minun, Illumise, Gulpin, Swalot, Camerupt, Spoink, Altaria, Spheal, Luvdisc, Beldum, Regirock, Regice, Registeel, Jirachi, Grotle, Torterra, Monferno, Infernape, Prinplup Empoleon, Bidoof, Budew, Glameow, Chingling, Stunky, Mime Jr, Chatot, Riolu, Hippowdon, Toxicroak, Mantyke, Lickilicky, Electivire, Uxie, Manaphy, Darkrai Victini, Snivy, Servine, Serperior, Tepig, Pignite, Emboar, Oshawott, Dewott, Samurott, Patrat, Watchog, Lillipup, Herdier, Stoutland, Purrloin, Liepard, Pansage, Simisage, Pansear, Simisear, Munna, Musharna, Tranquill, Blitzle, Zebstrika, Roggenrola, Boldore, Gigalith, Woobat, Swoobat, Timburr, Gurdurr, Conkeldurr, Tympole, Palpitoad, Seismitoad, Throh, Sawk, Venipede, Whirlipede, Scolipede, Petilil, Lilligant, Sandile, Krokorok, Krookodile, Darumaka, Darmanitan, Maractus, Dwebble, Crustle, Scraggy, Scrafty, Tirtouga, Archen, Archeops, Trubbish, Zoroark, Minccino, Cinccino, Ducklett, Swanna, Sawsbuck (All Forms), Karrablast, Foongus, Amoonguss, Frillish/Jellicent (Male and Female), Alomomola, Joltik, Galvantula, Ferroseed, Klink, Klang, Tynamo, Eelektrik, Axew, Fraxure, Haxorus, Braviary, Reshiram, Zekrom and Kyurem. Moonboy65 (talk) 04:14, 14 December 2014 (UTC)

Correct 1280 x 1280 sizes: Pidgeotto, Eeevee, Jolteon, Flareon, Vaporeon, Espeon, Umbreon, Pelipper, Sharpedo, Turtwig (Platinum), Chimchar (Platinum), Burmy (Sandy Cloak), Leafeon, Glaceon, Dialga, Palkia, Pidove, Drilbur, Excadrill, Zorua, Deerling (All Forms),

Pokémon Shuffle Data

Should Pokémon Shuffle data be added (base attack power, ability, etc.), and if so, where/how? I've seen info on where they appear in the game, but no other information. RetroKitty (talk) 19:38, 7 December 2015 (UTC)

Transfer only moves

Can we add a section to every Pokemon page that lists all the moves the Pokemon can know only if it originated in an earlier generation (move tutors, old TMs, etc.)? sumwun (talk) 18:18, 20 May 2017 (UTC)

I would be very much in support of that. I think it would be convenient and remove the need for cross-referencing pages when transferring Pokemon to later generations. I'm not sure how the information would be presented, though, and I think admins may veto the idea since the information is technically available already on other pages. slimey01 01:54, 21 May 2017 (UTC)

I think it could be structured similar to the table for tutor moves, but with the column for the game replaced with one for the method, as in a specific TM, move tutor, etc. For each method, we can use a superscript to say what games allow the method. I don't quite understand how those tables are programmed, but it could look something like this (using Fissure on Machamp as an example):

Method(s)	Move	Type	Cat.	Pwr.	Acc.	PP
TM27RGBYRBY	Fissure	Ground	Physical	??	30	5

Alternatively, game availability can be listed in a separate column.

Game(s)	Method(s)	Move	Type	Cat.	Pwr.	Acc.	PP
RGBYRBY	TM27	Fissure	Ground	Physical	??	30	5

Boblers (talk) 04:02, 21 May 2017 (UTC)

I think it would be best to have games in the first column and the method in the second.

So...is anyone going to do it? Do I have to list every transfer-only move for every Pokemon by myself? sumwun (talk) 17:24, 27 June 2017 (UTC)

The Editorial Board must approve such a drastic addition before you start doing it. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 18:00, 27 June 2017 (UTC)

How do I send requests to the Editorial Board? sumwun (talk) 17:03, 28 June 2017 (UTC)

Send a message to one of them on their user talk page. You can see who the members of the Editorial Board are at the staff listing. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 17:47, 28 June 2017 (UTC)

pokebank dex entry

is anyone compiling the pokedex entries from pokebank for non-alolan dex pokemon? do the admin plan to include this? i do not have pokebank so i cannot help, but would like to know if this is planned to be added -Pokeant (talk) 16:43, 25 May 2017 (UTC)

Sorry just ignore this. didnt know that pokebank just show the entries from the games. -Pokeant (talk) 16:56, 25 May 2017 (UTC)

Pokédex Number for certain Generation IV evolutions

This goes for any Generation IV evolution of a Pokémon in the Generation III Hoenn Pokédex: is there a way to remove the "000 in Generation III" from its Regional Pokédex Numbers? Here's an example. It's technically incorrect, as no data equating to any individual Generation IV evolution appears in the code of a Generation III game, and while potentially confusing, the biggest issue, to me, is that it is annoying. Of course, it won't be to everyone, so this should, by no means, be a priority, I was just wondering if it is possible to change this for these Generation IV evolutions. Surprisingly, at least to me, this is not an issue for the five Generation IV evolutions in the Johto Pokédex of HeartGold and SoulSilver. MarioMiner (talk) 16:16, 13 January 2018 (UTC)

...Can you be more specific about where you're seeing that, on that page? I'm using CTRL+F and I can't find it. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 19:22, 13 January 2018 (UTC)

I hope it's not too late to respond, but you see it if you use a PC and hover your mouse over "#181 Hoenn". sumwun (talk) 03:00, 18 July 2018 (UTC)

Alola Pokedex (USM)

A lot of (or all) Pokemon pages are missing their USM Alola Pokedex numbers. sumwun (talk) 03:00, 18 July 2018 (UTC)

gen 3 learnset template

Gen 3 is the only gen that do not have separate row for pokemon with moveset changes (compare this with this). Therefore i had created the template for gen 3, and it seems to be working fine. Would appreciate if an admin can review and mainspace the template if it is okay. thank you. -Pokeant (talk) 10:19, 27 February 2019 (UTC)

The spacing is off due to the "move to mainspace" template, but everything else is okay before i add that template. -Pokeant (talk) 10:24, 27 February 2019 (UTC)

Is there some way make the 2 columns not both red? sumwun (talk) 21:54, 27 February 2019 (UTC)

All the template uses the first version of the pair, such as the gen VII template which uses both the Sun and Ultra Sun color. So i just use Ruby and FireRed color. -Pokeant (talk) 04:18, 28 February 2019 (UTC)

(Response to initial talk) Actually, there doesn't seem to be one for G2 either. It's far less noticeable though, there's maybe four or five Pokemon who got changes. And of course, let's not forget about Deoxys gimmick in G3. Eridanus (talk) 10:17, 3 March 2019 (UTC)

didn't know someone already made the templates. But for deoxys, i don't think it is necessary, we can just stick to the current one where it is separated by forms, like the rest of the pokemon with forms -Pokeant (talk) 16:08, 4 March 2019 (UTC)

Pokedex Entries from Pokemon GO

Should the Pokemon articles also include the Dex entries from Pokemon GO? The pages already include other side games such as for Stadium. TehPerson (talk) 17:39, 30 March 2019 (UTC)

Unless I'm mistaken, thye're the same entries as in ORAS, so it's unlikely. --Spriteit (talk) 22:35, 30 March 2019 (UTC)

Ability changes

The Pokemon infobox template needs some way to say that Pelipper can't have drizzle before Generation 7. Also last year, I said that Pokemon infobox templates are missing USUM Pokedex numbers, and nobody responded. Does nobody care about that problem? sumwun (talk) 18:21, 30 March 2019 (UTC)

I'm not sure personally how to note that in Pelipper's infobox, however, regardings numbers. Sorry I didn't see your question last year but if you read the talk page on PokemonInfobox when you commented there with the same question that year, you'd find I had already answered the question twice on that page. USUM numbers won't be getting added to the infobox and in the (hopeful near) future, will be getting removed entirely, that's why we've been adding them to the Pokdex entry template. --Spriteit (talk) 22:35, 30 March 2019 (UTC)

I can see two ways to solve Pelipper's Ability problem without much trouble, but maybe they will still need some work in the template's code. The first would be adding one of those "mouse scroll notes" (or whatever they are called), like this: Keen Eye or Drizzle*. The other would be with the game's note: Keen Eye or Drizzle^SMUSUM. Even though they are both a bit different from the usual setting we have for the Abilities in the infobox template, I think it wouldn't be a big issue, since this is an exceptional case. Suic12- (talk) 02:24, 31 March 2019 (UTC)

I think the first idea can work, but the second one would cause slightly ugly clutter. For example, Seadra's abilities would be listed as "Poison Point or Sniper^{DPPtHGSSBWB2W2XYORASSMUSUM}". A third possibility is putting changes under a horizontal line (segment) like what we already did on Gengar and Scolipede. sumwun (talk) 16:17, 31 March 2019 (UTC)

Well, I wasn't considering the abilities changed between generations III and IV, but if you take them into account, I agree that my second idea wouldn't work so well. The way it is done in Gengar's page could also work, but might cause some confusion since it would repeat one of the abilities but give no further explanation about the other, which is the one that was actually changed. Suic12- (talk) 20:25, 31 March 2019 (UTC)

Two things

1. I would want to reword the sentence about unique base stat totals. Example (with Morpeko):
   • “Morpeko is the only Pokémon with a base stat total of 436”. - before rewording
   • “Morpeko's base stat total of 436 is unique”. - after rewording
2. The staff icon for Jo The Marten wasn't updated on the page about this project.

Please leave comments below for point 1, and the point 2 is an edit request. --TheICTLiker4 08:05, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

Transfer-only moves

I've drafted a template and compiled together info to begin displaying transfer-exclusive moves for each Pokémon in each generation. Eventually, I'd like the editorial board to have this available on the mainspace in each Pokémon's learset section, after any adjustments are made if necessary.

• Transfer-only moves (Generation VIII)
• Transfer-only moves (Generation VII)

The template entries are generated via script, so creating accurate listings for all other generations can be done quickly. In the meantime, I can only say for certain the information I have is 99% complete. A few edge cases (mainly event-exclusive moves and cross-generational evolution) have not been accounted for, but should be few enough to edit into manually- if anyone spots anything missing or out of place, feel free to add these in. TehPerson (talk) 16:36, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

This has been something I've actively been pushing for a long time, which is no secret among staff, I only ever got as far as putting together all the info in a document for 1 and 2, I can send it your way if it'll help with fleshing them out. --Spriteit (talk) 09:50, 13 June 2020 (UTC)

I'm still waiting for abcboy's reply, but as soon as there's a go, my first step is to go ahead and try to correct/flesh out TehPerson's listings. Maybe you also want to do so, or publish your info somewhere, for I suggest we work collaboratively rather than in (off-wiki) duos!? Nescientist (talk) 10:58, 13 June 2020 (UTC)

I'll have to dig out the document, I was doing it prior to gen 5, maybe 6? It's been a while.--Spriteit (talk) 08:42, 14 June 2020 (UTC)

Adding Pokémon GO to side-series Game Locations

Since a lot of Pokémon in GO have special availability (e.g. raids only, Special Research, etc.), I think PoGO should have its own cell in the Game Locations section. TehPerson (talk) 20:54, 11 June 2020 (UTC)

I could be behind this, as I mentioned in response on my talk page about the template update (albeit indirectly). My big concern would be keeping it up to date given how frequently the game cycles. However, I don't think that's a good enough reason to not include it. --Spriteit (talk) 09:50, 13 June 2020 (UTC)

As far as I know, only Field Research, Raid Battles, and Eggs are always subject to cycling, and we can use some legend (*) to mark such encounters. Maybe even include a footnote like "Availability from Eggs, Raid Battles, and Field Research may not necessarily be current." As for the templates, this is what I think they can be like for a few special cases.

Nincada

Generation VI GO Field Research*, Eggs* Wild (event only)

Kangaskhan

Generation VI GO Wild, Eggs* (Australia & Papua New Guinea only)

Regigigas

Generation VI GO A Colossal Discovery EX Raids (Nov 18, 2019 - Mar 13, 2020)

And just to add, I'm not exactly certain about using a Generation section for GO, since unlike other side games, GO has already spanned across 3 generations. I'm also wondering if it would be useful to include initial release date and Shiny availability, as other GO guide sites often include that. TehPerson (talk) 16:33, 13 June 2020 (UTC)

I know for some Shuffle entries we had inter-generational header for them so this could use a similar heading. I'm honestly not a fan of having a footnote in this instance, specifically for the fact that it will be a larger part of a whole table. Give me a few days to brainstorm. As for when the mons became available/shinies became available I feel like that'd be better suited to the side game template, potentially replacing the current Egg distance field. --Spriteit (talk) 08:42, 14 June 2020 (UTC)

Adding Egg Moves for all Parent that learn via Breeding

Currently, the articles only show Parents that learn via breeding if and only if no other parents can learn via level-up. Can we also include all parents that learn via breeding regardless? For people who do a lot of Egg Move breeding of different species, that kind of information is pretty valuable. TehPerson (talk) 17:28, 9 August 2020 (UTC)

Gen 7 learnsets

In every Pokemon's gen 7 learnset page (such as this one), the "by transfer from another generation" section says the Pokemon can't learn cut, strength, rock smash, and rock climb in gens 3 and 4, even though the first 3 moves were HMs in both those generations, and rock climb was an HM in gen 4. Can someone get a bot to fix this? sumwun (talk, contribs) 17:23, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

Pokémon couldn't be transferred up from those games if they knew HM moves. glik^glak 18:31, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

Okay thanks for explaining. sumwun (talk, contribs) 17:40, 20 February 2021 (UTC)

New Pokémon Snap locations

I think the locations of Pokémon in New Pokémon Snap should be added. The Pokémon Snap locations are already there, so it would make sense to add New Pokémon Snap locations. The Pokémon’s locations are already known, so I don’t see why not. --TheGamingDragapult (talk) 01:38, 21 June 2021 (UTC)

It's just that no one has added them, they aren't disallowed, some pages even have them. --Spriteit (talk) 02:09, 23 June 2021 (UTC)

Grouping of Side-game Data (for multiple forms)

Currently, the Side-Game data section for each Pokemon is grouped by Form first, then game. (examples: Pikachu, Cherrim, anything with a Mega Evolution), but it really should be the other way around. For a reader, they're more likely to be comparing different forms within the same game, rather than the same form across different games. TehPerson (talk) 17:17, 20 September 2021 (UTC)

Proposal

I say that we start artwork sections, so we can show the Dream World artwork and concept art.--MissDelibirda (talk) 10:57, 18 March 2022 (UTC)

Species format ideas

Discord https://discord.com/channels/202737349996576769/1060731919861567610 is having a conversation about species format. An on-wiki location for this discussion is also good. So that's here. Tiddlywinks (talk) 01:33, 6 January 2023 (UTC)

Here's a digest of the discussion so far, for users who aren't on Discord (though it's still recommended to join if you can):

The primary issues with the current species page format seem to be:

• Some older species pages, such as Pikachu (Pokémon), have gotten so massive that they don't load in a timely manner anymore.
• Anime and Manga information is listed first (prioritized, in a sense), however it seems that Games information is currently the most desired. Users have expressed frustration that they need to scroll so far to get to the Games info they want.
• Additionally, Game info is not split up by core vs spinoff, but is mixed together instead, meaning it can be hard to find all of the relevant info for just a single game.

Splitting the species pages into subpages could work, but then there's a concern that subpage names aren't intuitive to the average user.

During the Discord discussion, I suggested a navigation tab format, and started making a mockup in my sandbox here: User:Boblers/Pikachu (Pokémon).

Effectively, the idea is to:

• Split species tabs into themed subpages. For example: Species, Games, Anime, Manga, TCG, TFG. Naming could maybe be something like "Pikachu (Pokémon)/Games", or "Pikachu (Pokémon)/Anime"
• Populate each subpage with the theme's information. For example: Anime subpage has only Anime information, Games subpage has only Games information.
• For the Games subpage, split it into two large sections: core series and sidegames, with subheaders in each. This helps avoid the information-mixing problem.
• The species page would be the leftovers after splitting info into the subpages. In the mockup, the species page ended up focusing on the species biology, mannerisms, Pokédex entries, etc.
• Pages about specific individuals, such as Ash's Pikachu, don't receive their own tabs (there'd be way too many). However, they can still be linked as usual.
• The species page and all subpages would use a template, currently at User:Boblers/Speciestabs, which creates tab-shaped links to all of a species' pages - kind of like a navbox (this is based on a currently-unused template called Template:Tabs). This way, users can navigate subpages without having to know the subpages' names. For example, suppose a user wants to find Manga information about Pikachu. They would search "Pikachu" -> get directed to "Pikachu (Pokémon)" -> click the Manga tab to go to the Manga subpage -> arrive at the desired information.

For additional scalability, it has been suggested that the tabs template be modularized. To clarify what that means:

Currently, the template is called in a way like this:

{{User:Boblers/Speciestabs|species=Pikachu|type=electric|this-tab=species}}

This version of the template generates 6 pre-defined tabs every time. But, some species might not have information for all 6 tabs (for example, more-recent Pokémon might not have appeared in the Manga yet). With modularization, each tab could be a subtemplate, and only the requested tabs would be displayed. Effectively, something like this:

{{tabs|Pikachu|type=electric|t={{tabs/species}}{{tabs/game}}{{tabs/anime}}}}

This example would only display the Species, Game, and Anime tabs, as those were the only ones requested.

If this tab format is successful, the modularized version could be extended to non-Pokémon pages as well - for example, trainers such as Silver could have a tab for their Masters page. But that may be thinking ahead a bit.

Modularization has not been implemented yet in the mockup - the main concern at the moment is whether we're okay with the format (we have over 1,000 Pokémon pages to change, each of which can have 2-5 or more tabs, so we need to be confident about it).

Reception to this idea in Discord has been positive, but it would be good to gauge impressions here, too. --Boblers (talk) 11:48, 14 January 2023 (UTC)

I still think this looks really good. I have a few concerns left that I wanted to point out.

• Trying to load the Pikachu games subpage still took my 15-20 seconds, so we didn't fix that main problem, we just moved it to the most problematic location. I tried multiple times and compared it to other things, so I don't think it's a me issue.
• This might just be an investment vs payout problem, but the main species page example just look like the undesired leftovers after cannibalizing the desired information onto subpages.
• One complaint we have, or at least used to have, is readers having to click through a bunch of links to get to where they wanted to go. The tabs might make this problem worse if we don't approach it correctly.
• We still need to figure out how to incorporate the facets of the franchise that aren't just the "big four" from 15 years ago (anime, games, manga, TCG). I don't think having a dozen broken up subpages is a great solution for that, but I don't currently have a solution that meshes well with this mock-up. ^Maverick_Nate 12:16, 14 January 2023 (UTC)

Since the main series game data is the most desirable and shouldn't be moved further away it needs to stay on the main page. That means Side series, Anime, Manga, TCG and TFG could be its own one subpage.--Rocket Grunt 12:42, 14 January 2023 (UTC)

Bulbapedia's brand is built on those species pages being the centerpiece of a lot of information about the species themselves. Game data being most desirable to many doesn't mean that, for instance, trivia should get relagated somewhere else. I don't know if making the species pages solely focused on games fits in with the cohesive foundation we've built for the wiki around those pages being the Pokémon as a whole. ^Maverick_Nate 04:32, 15 January 2023 (UTC)

Regarding Nate's concerns (not necessarily solving them, just my takes):

• Loading Games page: I've now split the Games page into separate Core and Side games pages, to see if that would fix it. On my end it improved the load to about 7-10 seconds each (almost even), though you may want to test on your end again too. If one of those pages is still slow, we may need to move some information off of them (event data, shuffle data, or GO data seem quite large at a glance).
• Main species page leftovers: Yeah, I didn't spend a lot of time on it, so I agree it looks kinda messy and has obvious holes in it (the "other appearances" header in particular, when not many appearances are listed before it post-split). I'm fairly sure it could be done more elegantly with some effort, though.
• Clicking a lot: Is the frustration perhaps about looking through a lot of text + clicking a lot, rather than purely clicking a lot? For instance, going to a page and needing to read through a long TOC for the right section. I feel like tabs might be less frustrating due to the pictures in them, and since they are at the top to minimize scrolling - it can be easier to visually pick out the right section link this way, without having to scroll and read every single one on the TOC. This wouldn't eliminate TOC of course, but would decrease the amount of TOC reading needed. In my experience with other wikis, users tend to be very receptive to images, icons, and shortcuts, and less receptive to large amounts of text. Just my two cents, though.
• Non-big-four topics: I still think tabs could address this (though I'm probably super biased at this point). I get the sense that a big concern with non-big-four stuff is that people don't even know they exist, and/or those that do know have trouble searching for them. Tabs would help by increasing visibility across more-popular-but-still-related pages.

I actually have a concern of my own: that too many tabs could cause problems on mobile, since the current version is effectively a one-row table and doesn't wrap when the page is too narrow. We could explore changing tabs into a sort of "button pad" 3-by-Y grid instead, perhaps? If we can figure this out, then I think we could have as many tabs/buttons as needed for a given page, while staying mobile-friendly.--Boblers (talk) 10:16, 15 January 2023 (UTC)

(resetting indent) My intuition is that most of this sounds like a problem that is to be solved by technology.

I haven't really looked into it, and maybe it's a stretch, but is there a way to do the tabs thing, and still have it at one page? Some css magic, lazy loading.. something!? ..Or maybe even not do the tabs thing? If it weren't for loading times, I believe I would rather keep the page as is (give or take some shuffling around, maybe)!?

I'm usually starting with what I want it to be, and then try to match the current state and the issues against that. And my intuition is technology. (Just wanna throw this out there. Sorry if it's the opposite of what's been done. Feel free to ignore if I'm just deflecting.) Nescientist (talk) 15:04, 15 January 2023 (UTC)

When I initially brought up the tabs idea, Nate misunderstood it as still having all of the content on the one page - he said that this would not lessen the load times, and that it was brought up before but was shot down. That's not to say it can't be done (maybe there's a way, I'm not a CSS expert), but the impression I got was that it probably wouldn't work.

Also, an update: I've lessened the width of the tabs, and allowed the text to wrap. When tested on mobile, the tabs are easily scrollable left-right, so that usability concern is fixed. --Boblers (talk) 17:19, 18 January 2023 (UTC)

Per discord discussion, there's been a suggestion to use a format similar to Zelda Wiki's Quick Links box. I've drafted up a sample in my userspace here: User:Boblers/Nav_button. Visually, the idea with this is a panel of buttons, rather than a row of tabs.

Unlike tabs, this can wrap according to user's screen size, which prevents needing to scroll sideways for mobile and small desktop screens. This is also modular, so we can specify exactly which buttons we want for each page (which is something we wanted tabs to eventually do anyway).

However, it does require the editor to specify more information (icon file name, link name, displayed link name). The "core series games" button is also kind of big, I'm not sure how to make the button wrap the text within itself.

Making each subpage compelling to visit is still a concern, though. --Boblers (talk) 07:09, 6 March 2023 (UTC)

Unique traits

We've been discussing on Discord whether or not it would be better to integrate unique traits such as signature moves, Abilities, and items, and exclusive Z-Moves and G-Max Moves in with the prose of the Biology section, or whether its better to keep the info together in one easy-to-find place, such as at the bottom (which is how we have it now, in most cases). I've come up with an example for what integrating the info could look like with an edge case like Pikachu. I've also incorporated subsections for the different variants and forms. Please let me know your thoughts. Landfish7 07:16, 16 March 2023 (UTC)

Game Location Standardization

After working with in game encounters for the better part of two months I would like to point out issue we have Game location Boxes, mostly the inconsistent style.

1. Dual Slot Encounters.

Generation IV Diamond Pearl Route 227, Stark Mountain (LeafGreen) Diamond Pearl Route 227, Stark Mountain (LeafGreen)

The top entry is the style we currently use, while the one below is what I propose we change it to. My reasoning is that if a player needs and another game or external event in order to access a Pokémon, it should be hollow like any other Pokémon unobtainable via the game itself.

2. Sword and Shield Version Differences.

Generation VIII Sword Shield Rolling Fields, Axew's EyeSw (Max Raid Battle) Sword Rolling Fields, Axew's Eye (Max Raid Battle) Shield Rolling Fields (Max Raid Battle)

Both the top entry and the bottom 2 on the table are currently in use on this website. Because of how version exclusivity works in SwSh raids, often the only difference in the game locations is a single raid den, which is probably why one user implemented the first system. We should probably review every Pokémon available in SwSh and correct it to the second style, because it's more consistent with how we display encounters in every other game.

3. BDSP and PLA Save Data Bonus Pokémon In BDSP you can receive a Mew and Jirachi if you have LGPE or SwSh save data on your console. Likewise, PLA will unlock missions allowing you to catch Darkrai or Shaymin if you have SwSh or BDSP save data on the console. I've objected to having these entries be colored in as these are essentially events. While the events themselves will last for an infinite amount of time, they require the use of another game, the same hurdle as transferring or trading. If the unlock requirements for these Pokémon require means outside of your single copy of the game, I believe it should be hollow. Just like the dual slot mode.

4. Scarlet and Violet

Generation IX Scarlet East Province: Area One (Paldean Form (Combat Breed)) East Province: Area Two, Area Three (Paldean Form (Combat and Blaze Breeds)) West Province: Area Two, Asado Desert (Paldean Form (Combat and Blaze Breeds)) East Province: Area Two (Electric Tera Type) (Paldean Form (Combat Breed)) Union Circle (Paldean Form (Aqua Breed)) Tera Raid Battles (4★, 6★) (Paldean Form (Combat Breed)) Tera Raid Battles (5★, 6★) (Paldean Form (Blaze Breed)) Tera Raid Battle Search (5★, 6★) (Paldean Form (Aqua Breed)) Pokémon HOME (Kantonian Form)

Scarlet and Violet have several problems with how we list Pokémon, and Tauros here makes for a perfect example. One is the way we list the Pokémon by province at all. This seems like an extremely arbitrary system that simply bloats the page and makes it harder to read. This is especially prevalent with Pokémon with multiple forms. Legends Arceus is the closest parallel. There we only list Pokémon by sublocation, without specifying the greater area.

Next is the Tera Raid Battle Search and Union Circle. I honestly like these designations, but I do not believe they should supersede trading. In fact, I believe we should list all 3 methods in parallel to each other. There's also the bigger issue that we currently do not list raid searching as an option in Sword and Shield, meaning we should retroactively implement this styling system. - unsigned comment from Brin (talk • contribs)

Name Request

Hi there, I was directed here based on a good suggestion. There is a strong contend and majoirt want to change the Mew Duo name to Relationship between Mewtwo and Mew, to solve the fan naming for offical legendary groups or those who have connections with each uch as the Mew duo. I brining this here to see if we get more support and apporval for this please? Anmd thagt way we can start the steps for other potentially.--Jacob9594 (talk) 13:31, 21 February 2024 (UTC)

The TCG not printing Mewtwo and Mew in the same sets, and the fact there are 0 cards that reference each other short of the TAG TEAM together make for very strong evidence that these Pokémon are in fact not a "duo".Salmancer (talk) 05:15, 2 June 2024 (UTC)

Freeze-Dry should be noted

I think that it should be noted if a Pokémon takes additional damage from Freeze-Dry --CuteShaymin (talk) 18:26, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

If we were to implement this idea, I don't think this requires manually editing each Pokémon article. Instead, it is possible to edit the type effectiveness template so it would automatically display the Freeze-Dry information in all articles of Water-type Pokémon.

However, I think that we haven't been doing this so far because Freeze-Dry simply affects all Water-type Pokémon the same way. The type effectiveness table in Pokémon articles specifically says that it is about "normal battle conditions" rather than what happens when specific moves are used.

If we started explaining the effects of specific moves like Freeze-Dry in the type effectiveness of every Water Pokémon article, technically it would also be possible to add this to all Pokémon species that are not Water-type as well: "If this Pokémon is affected by Soak, it becomes a pure Water-type and therefore takes 2× damage from the move Freeze-Dry." In fact, we could technically add the entire Water type effectiveness table in every Pokémon article just in case that Pokémon might be affected by Soak at some point.

In my opinion, maybe we should check if the type article is currently good enough to explain all the possible details of type effectiveness, including how certain moves like Flying Press, Freeze-Dry, and Thousand Arrows have different rules. This way we keep all the information together in one place rather than repeating the same thing in hundreds of Pokémon articles. --Daniel Carrero (talk) 23:11, 20 May 2024 (UTC)