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Talk:Hydreigon (Pokémon)

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Name Origin

The name part "Zan" is similar to "san", 3 in japanese, is a reference to how many heads it has. - unsigned comment from Franztrovao (talkcontribs)

Discussion on moving to "Sazandra (Pokémon)"

Move. The "ra" is obviously there, and was probably missed when the name "Sazando" was created. Ztobor 10:47, 30 September 2010 (UTC)

..how did that get missed? Ataro 01:40, 1 October 2010 (UTC)
Should it be moved? DeadUniverse Hello! 08:29, 1 October 2010 (UTC)
NO. Hi! Talk to me! 02:49 p.m., 1 October 2010 (not UCT).
Why not?--でんのう Zえんし 18:55, 1 October 2010 (UTC)
Sazandra is the romanization of this Pokémon's name. Therefore, why not move it accordingly? ~Kianglo 20:50, 1 October 2010 (UTC)
Has it come out officially yet? If not, we should move it to "Sazandora" first. Serebii has actually changed it now. Ztobor 00:00, 2 October 2010 (UTC)
I have no idea. It was the people at Serebii first, I think. It's understandable - I mean, I missed the "do" in front of "doryuuzu" when I first tried to romanize its name. But now that we know what it is correctly, we should change it accordingly, is what I think. Ztobor 00:00, 2 October 2010 (UTC)
Well, the kana reads "Sa-za-n-do-ra," which would suggest "Sazandora," but the pronunciation is more like "Sazandra," based on general rules of the language. So it depends on whether we want the actual or the phonetic pronunciation, but from looking at the majority of the pages here, the Japanese names are spelled phonetically. I'd recommend "Sazandra" (because I have a theory that "-dra" comes from "Hydra" or maybe "dragon.") ~Kianglo 00:41, 2 October 2010 (UTC)
Yeah, it's obviously "dra", like Urugamoth instead of Urugamosu.--でんのう Zえんし 06:37, 2 October 2010 (UTC)
Since everyone agrees, I'm going to move it. Anyway, it is incorrect now, so it needs to be fixed as soon as possible. --SnorlaxMonster 15:04, 2 October 2010 (UTC)
Just my own two cents: Kingdra. Seadra. TTEchidna 09:31, 14 October 2010 (UTC)
I would like Sazandra. Also, shouldn't is be noted that mono- = one, jihe in Chinese means group (v.), and zan (or san) is three? - unsigned comment from 444Zekrom (talkcontribs)
Who revived this discussion? TTE? Boy, I'ma cut you.
Sazandora is the trademarked romaji. We use trademarked romaji once we have it. We aren't moving this article to anything that isn't "Sazandora" until the English names come 'round. End of discussion. 梅子 19:21, 15 October 2010 (UTC)

Sazandora based on King Ghidorah

A bit of copy and paste from Ulgamoth's talk page, but oh well...

I know that if someone adds to the origin that Sazandora may have been inspired by King Ghidorah, it will get taken done because it is apparently just an opinion. However, the two share similarities in appearance, destructive tendencies, ability to fly (levitate for sazandora) and Sazandora's name may also even be based on Ghidorah's. I don't think this is just an "opinion", and may be a legitimate origin.

Your thoughts? - 050294 09:06, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

  • They're right next to each other in the National Dex. Exhibit B. Yurtablemoron 06:49, 24 October 2010 (UTC)
To say this Pokémon is based on something in popular culture is an opinion. Regardless of how much it sounds like it's based on it, you can't say it's based on King Ghidorah because it's an opinion. -Sketch 19:09, 28 October 2010 (UTC)
Problem with what you're saying Sketch: Hydra ain't got no wings and cannot float by any means. Ghidorah can, so the Hydra CANNOT be the only explanation. Since you are not Game Freak you cannot control what a Pokémon is based on like that, as it is GAME FREAK's decision on what a Pokémon is based on. If they have Sazandora based on Ghidorah then they have Sazandora based on Ghidorah, end of story. Shiramu Kuromu 19:58, 28 October 2010 (UTC)
Like I just said on the other one, you aren't GameFreak either. It is your opinion that this is what the Pokémon is based on. Since it is your opinion, and not fact, it cannot be said that it is its origin. Unless you can prove it, with physical evidence that says the Pokémon is based on this monster, it cannot be said, period. -Sketch 01:22, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
But isn't it your opinion that this is not based, or at least makes reference, on Ghidorah? Therefore, you'd need evidence that it was NOT based on it before removing possible origins. - 050294 02:01, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
And due to the wings and destructive nature stated by PokéDex entries, there's more evidence relating to Ghidorah than evidence not relating it to Ghidorah. Shiramu Kuromu 08:07, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
I personally think you guys provided enough evidence here. I mean Ghidorah... Sazandora... they sound similar. And it's next to the Pokémon that resembles Mothra in the Pokédex. You've convinced me anyway. And it wouldn't be the first time we have icons of pop culture in the origins section. What about all the references to Pulseman we have? I think that if their is enough evidence supporting it, than it should be mentioned as a possible origin. I won't deny that it is an opinion, but so are pretty much all origin sections. Pop culture or not. That's my 2 cents --ケンジガール 08:37, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
In that same vein, it has (rightfully) been pointed out that Abagoura is likely to have been based on Gamera. I think that the connection made between Archeos and Gyaos is a little more tenuous, but there are some similarities. Above all, though, I think it would be highly appropriate to at least make reference to Ghidorah as a possible influence. Kamen no Otoko 12:59, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
Abagoura being based on Gamera is a bit more tenuous IMO; frankly, Blastoise looks more similar. --AndyPKMN 16:04, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
This is why you don't put stuff like this up, because it's an opinion that everyone may not share. -Sketch 16:26, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
You saying that these Pokémon aren't based on Kaiju is ALSO an opinion, as like you said, everyone may not share, which is right, as you're the ONLY one here saying they're not based on Kaiju. Shiramu Kuromu 19:06, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

Actually the armor and "fangs" makes Abagoura look more like Gamera than Blastoise. - 050294 18:10, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

See, it looks more like a mask than "fangs" to me. But arguing about Abagoura really doesn't belong here, so I'll just let y'all keep talking about Sazandora and King Ghidora. --AndyPKMN 20:37, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
I could believe Mothra, but not this. Sazandora looks NOTHING like King Ghidora. The only similarities are that they are both flying three-headed dragons, which are highly common in popular culture. Not only that, but its other 2 heads aren't even real heads like Ghidora; the Pokédex states that they don't have brains, and they are really just heads on the ends of arms. --SnorlaxMonster 01:52, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

I personally think that sazandora is based on king ghidorah I mean the names sound alot alike and they look alot alike. Its kinda like how feraligatr is based on godzilla. - unsigned comment from Mewtwomaster (talkcontribs)

WTF? Feraligatr ISN'T based on godzilla. Don't add to discussions unless you have something meaningful to contribute (and by meaningful I mean new evidence, not just opinion). And also, sign your posts. --AndyPKMN 00:46, 10 November 2010 (UTC)
now now..let's not bite peoples heads off andy... but he's right..Feraligatr and Godzilla look nothing alike Ataro 00:50, 10 November 2010 (UTC)
Well the large spikes on Feraligatr's head, back, and tail DO resemble those seen on Godzilla..... But otherwise the two share nothing in common unless Feraligatr happened to have recover and STAB for Hyper Beam, but even then I wouldn't say those would be similarities either.... Shiramu Kuromu 19:58, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

Um what about Hydro Cannon? That could be a version of Godzilla's atomic breath.Mewtwomaster 22:27, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

Those moves are nothing alike..Ataro 23:03, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

Well there both blue and I've always thought that it was a beam like attack.Mewtwomaster 14:29, 27 November 2010 (UTC)

Hello there, I'm new so I don't really know how to sign my posts in advance, but please excuse me. Feraligatr looks like the American Godzilla. Sceptile is the one for Japanese Godzilla. And also, there is no other option of a Pokemon looking like Ghidorah but Dodrio, which dosen't look anything like it as it's a three headed bird. Sazandora is more monsterous looking. I must also point out that Ulgamoth looks nothing like Mothra. Beautifly has her wings but Butterfree is what it's similar to. Also, a Shiny Butterfree♂ would look like Mothra Leo. But as a matter of fact, this whole discussion page is really about the similarity between Sazandora and King Ghidorah. They both have the "dora" in their names. Also, Sazandora can learn Charge Beam, so that can be used for King Ghidorah's gravity/lightning beams. - PeterFoster111, 15/02/11, 09:20.

Honestly, anyone who says Hydra next couldn't be more wrong. The reseamblence is in name only. Hydreigon is clearly a tribute to/based on King Ghidorah. The behavior, many abilities; and body plan all match up exactly like King Ghidorah. Hydras to not have wings, nor do they go around blowing things up for no reason. Hydreigon is a Ghidorah tribute, plain and simpleTarbtano 20:59, 4 June 2011 (UTC)

This discussion is over. It is based on a Yamata no Orochi. We have official confirmation. The reason you are seeing minor similarities between the two is that Ghidorah is also inspired by a Yamata no Orochi. --SnorlaxMonster 14:04, 5 June 2011 (UTC)

Error

I found an error and I'm lost on how to fix it so maybe by telling "you" the error maybe you can fix it. But in the Pokedex entries it says that this Pokemon was not obtainable prior to generation (one), when it should be "was not prior to Generation (five)" with the whole Roman numeral thing. However when I looked at the source I couldn't see anything wrong with it (with my limited knowledge on "wiki-type" editing). So hopefully you can fix it. --Dman dustin 10:45, 5 November 2010 (UTC)

Found it. There was a stray "?" in the gen parameter not commented out, so the template got confused.(Dion24) 11:04, 5 November 2010 (UTC)
I actually got rid of the ? as well. It's not required; clearly we don't know the Black entry if it's not there. —darklordtrom 11:08, 5 November 2010 (UTC)
Speaking of which, I've noticed that most of the new Pokémon only have dex entries for White version. Does no one on the wiki have Black, or are the entries the same in each one? --Element03 15:05, 5 November 2010 (UTC)
Sorry, I just looked and we do have the entries. Nevermind. --Element03 15:11, 5 November 2010 (UTC)

Dark Pulse

Mind telling me how a Pokemon learns an egg move by breeding with it's own species when it doesn't learn that move by level up or TM? It says Dark Pulse can be bred onto Sazandora by breeding with another Sazandora but it doesn't learn the move by level up. Neither Monozu nor Jiheddo learn it by level up either...... Shiramu Kuromu 19:55, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

It learns it as a Monozu. Pikiwyn talk 20:17, 15 November 2010 (UTC)
Like I said already, Monozu doesn't learn it by level up either. The ONLY Dark Type moves Monozu learns at all are Bite and Crunch. Are you sure you're not getting confused with Dragon Pulse? Shiramu Kuromu 01:02, 21 November 2010 (UTC)
(edit conflict) I haven't tried it myself, but I hear it's a breeding oddity in BW. Apparently you have to teach it as a TM in Gen IV to a Pokémon that can breed with Monozu's line, then PokéShift. Bluesun 20:18, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

Catch Rate

Is the catch rate really 190? That's abnormally high for a Pseudo-legendary. --Burnt Toffee 15:07, 24 November 2010 (UTC)

Fixed. It's 45, like any other pseudo-legendary. I also corrected it on Deino's and Zweilous' pages. Xel 18:14, 26 April 2011 (UTC)

Origin

I think it's origin is probobly a Hydra. Look it up on Google - unsigned comment from Mesuxelf (talkcontribs)

First of all, you should sign all posts on talk pages with four tildes (~). In regards to your suggestion, it used to be on the page. I assume it no longer is because the new origin more accurately describes the Pokémon (a key element of the Hydra legend is that it grows two more heads for each head cut off, which does not apply to Sazandora). --AndyPKMN (talk) 19:47, 25 November 2010 (UTC)

yep.----EBL (talk to me!) 21:06, 25 November 2010 (UTC)

The hydra is a poisonous water serpent with multiple heads. Other than both being Polycephal, Sazandora is nothing like the Lernaean Hydra of Greek lore. - 050294 04:21, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

Brutality

This is just trivia, but ain't Sharpedo the Brutal Pokémon, too? --PantheonSasuke 22:04, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

The name could change in translation, so we shouldn't have species name trivia for Gen V Pokémon yet. --SnorlaxMonster 00:27, 27 November 2010 (UTC)
If that's the case, someone might wanna take down mention of Espeon and Sunflora in Ulgamoth's article... --PantheonSasuke 00:41, 27 November 2010 (UTC)
I think it should be hidden until the English species names are confirmed. --SnorlaxMonster 00:50, 27 November 2010 (UTC)

English name

Just to let you all know, the english names have been confirmed. Sazandora's english name is Hydreigon. Its evolutionary family's names (Deino, Zweilous, and Hydreigon) all contain the German words for one, two, and three (Eins, Zwei, and Drei) based on the number of heads they have. As such, Hydreigon's name appears to come from "Hydra," "drei," and "dragon." --Kianglo 00:42, 3 February 2011 (UTC)

Unless you can provide an official source, we can only assume that this name came from a fansite. --SnorlaxMonster 09:34, 15 February 2011 (UTC)
Can ANYONE notice the similarity in Hydreigon to HYDROGEN?--Celibi25 16:29, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
Yes, there is a similarity, but, as Kianglo has stated, "Hydra", "drei" (German for three), and "dragon" are words that makes up Hydreigon. Onxanthy 19:59, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
Well, the French name is Trioxhydre, with "oxyd" as a part of it. Hydrogen, oxyd... there must be a relationship, but I can't see which one it could be Xel 18:12, 26 April 2011 (UTC)

Official source. Hydreigon is based on a Japanese dragon(YAMATA NO OROCHI).

The source is Nintendo Dream vol.205. Sawamular101 00:57, 12 April 2011 (UTC)

Beatles reference?

I know comparisons have been made between the haircut similarities with deino/beatles, but earlier I considered that zweilous evolves at level 64- a reference to 'When I'm 64'? I remember seeing somewhere that some of GameFreak worked on Earthbound, which had a few Beatles references in it also... From the King Ghidorah and Mothra discussions above I know you don't like adding anything not officially confirmed, especially relating to pop culture, but I thought it was an interesting observation. If you want a bit more speculation, I believe it also learns all of the 'sonic' moves (Round, Echoed Voice, Screech, etc)... Z-dan 20:13, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

Probably not. Pop culture origins typically need far more supporting evidence before we consider them. But thanks for asking on the talk page before just adding it on the page. --AndyPKMN (talk) 00:36, 4 May 2011 (UTC)

teeth

Deino hasn't any teeth, Zweilous has (so far I know) only teeth on it's right head and Hydreigon has it's teeth on the head in the middle. So Deino's head is Zweilous's left head while Zweilous's right head is Hydreigon's middle head?

trivia?

isn't it also true that hydreigon is the only pseudo that can learn fly that is not a flying type.T3thegreat 14:07, 26 September 2011 (UTC)

Yes, but that's definitely unnotable for the article.--Den Zen 14:11, 26 September 2011 (UTC)

What about the fact that Hydreigon is the only Dark type pokemon that has levitate? Questioner 17:37, 26 October 2011 (UTC)

It would only really be important if everything else that had Levitate were the same type. --SnorlaxMonster 06:27, 27 October 2011 (UTC)

Point about Hydras

A litttle point i'd like to make after reading up on Hydras and comparing them to several pokemon: Gyarados is closer to a Hydra, simply because it is basicly an alien water snake. Hydras tend to live in water and are basicly polycephil sea serpants that are able to crawl on land. Like stated above, Hydras cannot fly, so therefore this pokemon, hydreigon is not at all a Hydra. I think that Hydra should only be mentioned under name origin. Nothing mean, just a little point I wanted to rase, I don't want to be the catalyst of a fight. If I am missing anything though, please, fill me in. I even had someone describe the looks of the pokemon to me, and Gyarados looks closer to a monocephal hydra. Christian Woods Azu! 03:30, 12 November 2011 (UTC)

Shiny Sugimori Art

Any chance of there being a higher quality version than the one in the scans I've seen for it months ago? Shiramu Kuromu 20:26, 1 December 2011 (UTC)

Mention of King Ghidorah?

Although no design bases have been officially stated for Hydreigon other than the Orochi itself, quite a few fans speculate that it's based on King Ghidorah. Although some think otherwise, it might be worth noting, since Ghidorah isn't just a stereotypical three-headed dragon. Both Hydreigon and Ghidorah are based on Orochi itself, and have three heads rather than eight, so I'd say that it's unlikely that the designers completely ignored Ghidorah when designing the Pokémon. There are even fewer similarities between Hydreigon and the other mythological dragons listed, so is the Ghidorah thing worth noting?--Darthrai (talk) 23:08, 1 March 2013 (UTC)

EDIT: Just saw the argument above, but is it still a coincidence that they have the same number of heads/limbs and same design basis?--Darthrai (talk) 23:12, 1 March 2013 (UTC)

Mention of shiny form possibly being a reference to Zmey Gorynych

Yello there! Earlier, I added a tidbit to Hydreigon's origin involving both its slavic dragon origin and shiny colors, as being possibly based on slavic dragons may mean the shiny colors could be a reference to the Zmey Gorynych who was a specific, three headed slavic dragon who was green and had two "small paws" as feet (which the little stubs resemble slightly)

Anywho, this was taken down and the reason was, essentially, "shiny colors rarely reference anything in Pokemon" I wish to contest this because, honestly, shiny colors have been mentioned in other Pokemon origins as possible references just fine (for example, Kink's evolution family's origin section mentions a possible copper oxidation reference it may possibly have due to its shiny colors. Petilil also mentions references possible origins due to its shiny colorization)

Considering the strong resemblance and the high chance its partial origin was slavic dragons then, hey, why not mention the possible reference the green, shiny coloration may have to the specific Slavic dragon in folklore, Zmey Gorynych? Just want to hear your thoughts on this. - 050294 (talk) 04:40, 5 May 2013 (UTC)

Sorry, my wording may not have been the best there. I meant that Shiny coloration are rarely a reference to any specific character or entity. Klink and Petilil both list their Shiny colorations as reference to phenomenon or design origins, not characters. While Zmey Gorynych was a specific green slavic dragon, he was also a typical example of a slavic dragon. There's not much to link him to Hydreigon's Shiny form, other than his color as his design is apparently typical for dragons from that region. If they shared more in common, I'd be more inclined to accept the trivia. As it is, I don't feel it's worth noting as a particular design origin or reference. Crystal Talian 07:10, 5 May 2013 (UTC)
Apologies for the late reply, but thank you for the elaboration! - 050294 (talk) 01:32, 7 May 2013 (UTC)