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HM Usage Requirements

Requirements for each game should be listed here - I mean the required badges. These are listed on some of the HMs' Move pages, but only a few. So I propose we put all of these requirements here on this page, for ease of access. Satosuke 16:40, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

Never mind, there's separate pages for the actual HMs (separate from the moves). Still, the moves themselves should have the badge requirements too. Satosuke 16:42, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

Wrong side of barrier

"The reason for this is a player can be stuck on the wrong side of a barrier, for example a smashable rock, without the appropriate HM move."

I can understand the idea of being trapped on a side of a smashable rock, but there's something wrong with it. To get on the wrong side, you'd need a Pokemon that knows the right HM Move. To have it, you'd (obviously) need the HM. Even if the Pokemon forgot the move, you can reuse HMs, and reteach it. I suppose if you traded for, say, Cut in FRLG, you could be trapped, but that is the exception, not the norm. That was lengthy, especially since nobody will probably read this.--Gou 21:54, 3 August 2009 (UTC)
Still, the creators probably thought it through for that sort of thing to not happen. And plus, in Gen 1 (not sure about any other gens) you could put an HM in the item box... and then you'd really be screwed. --CherryParanoia 01:17, 8 December 2009 (UTC)

Where to use.

After hearing of HG/SS turning Whirlpool back into an HM I began to search to see if it was going to be required to get further into the game such as moves like Surf and Waterfall. I couldn't find anything. I was wondering if each HM page could have a section on where the HM is required to be used in each game, kind of like which route would require which HM to procede. Is this possible or would it not be allowed? Are there already pages with this information? Just wondering.Zabbethx 14:32, 24 September 2009 (UTC)

Non-HM Compatible

I noticed that the lake guardians were non-HM-compatible. Barring those that are non-TM-compatible, which others are non-HM compatible? ht14 06:14, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

I don't think there are any... But that's lazy ol' me. CuboneKing 06:17, 2 January 2010 (UTC)
All one would need to do is to take on a tedious task of looking through all the compatability lists...for each generation, and even between games taking place in different countries in the case of HM05 in Generation IV or between Red, Green, and Blue and Yellow in Generation I. Remember, a Pokémon that may not be compatible with any HMs in one generation may be compatible with at least one in another. Butterfree, for example, wasn't compatible with any HMs until Yellow when it became compatible with HM05 (then Flash), yet again became incompatible with any HM in HeartGold and SoulSilver when the aformentioned HM05 (now teaching Defog in Diamond and Pearl) had its move and compatability list changed for HeartGold and SoulSilver. (For the record, Butterfree is still compatible with the TM70 version of Flash.) --Shiningpikablu252 13:14, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

Generation III migration

Should it be noted that even though Flash is not an HM move in Generation IV, it must still be deleted from Pokémon in the Generation III games before they can be transferred to Generation IV games? I have tested this multiple times. Dive is likely the same. --Locrian 14:08, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

No. The reason they get kept is so that you don't get locked into or out of an area in Generation III. —darklordtrom 20:37, 3 September 2010 (UTC)


Now that we know the badges require to use the Generation V HMs, can't we input the info?--444Zekrom 06:29, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

There is no reason why you can't. Wikis are made for editing. Go edit. —darklordtrom 06:36, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
And if whoever updates this page could also add them to the individual HM pages that would be nice. The parameter is badge5 although if the Icicle badge is needed for one of them then the template will need to be edited for it to work properly. Werdnae (talk) 06:49, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

HMs needed: Yes or No?

I can't check first hand, but various users are claiming you need the badges to use HMs in Black and White, while others on this site are saying you don't. Which is it? --HoennMaster 19:14, 16 January 2011 (UTC)

You definatley need the badges HM, ha, thats funny this in is the HM page and your somtimes called HM Diamond Lanturn CodeName: 05308 21:16, 16 January 2011 (UTC)

Unova Badges

Is it now ok to remove what badges are need to use the HMs in Unova. There is no mention in-game of them allowing the use of HMs, and I've even used Strength before beating Elesa. --HoennMaster 15:46, 12 March 2011 (UTC)

Usage in anime

This page states that Ash's Grotle was the first Pokémon of the main cast to use a HM that was current (which I believe means that it was current in the generation it was used), but Tracey's Scyther used Cut before that, in Showdown at the Oak Corral, if I'm not mistaking... Cut has been an HM since forever, and Scyther used it earlier, but it wasn't in the main series. Opinions? Hoolo 14:59, 27 April 2011 (UTC)

HM's in GenV

Is there really anything differentiating HM's from TM's in Gen V? All TM's are reusable, and there are ones that act outside of battle, like Dig. Is it just the "Unforgettable" nature of HM's now? --Aescula 15:03, 24 July 2011 (UTC)

Yes. --LimeGreenCharizard-- 06:34, 16 September 2011 (UTC)


Can someone enlighten me as to why this article is "incomplete"? --LimeGreenCharizard-- 06:35, 16 September 2011 (UTC)

Badge requirements and Gen V

"badges are required to use some of the Hidden Machines in the games as the player can not access the events where they receive certain HMs until a Gym Leader has been defeated."

Has this actually be tested by trading over a Pokemon with the HM to use them? The way I see it, the inability to receive the TM before getting the badge does not make it's use restricted, but rather, the game preventing you from using the move on the field (like it did in Gens I-IV) to be the true sign of a badge/HM restriction. RB Golbat 00:10, 3 October 2011 (UTC)

You're right, but there is no need to change anything because the exact part you quoted explains everything. --LimeGreenCharizard-- 02:54, 3 October 2011 (UTC)
It doesn't though. The big question is do the badges actually allow the use of HM moves, as in earlier generations, or not? If you were to trade, say, a Frillish knowing Surf to someone who had just got the ability to trade (Shortly after the Striaton Gym, well before you can get Surf in game), would they be able to use that Frillish to surf on route 1? In previous generations, where you had to actually posess the relevant badge, they could not. If they can, it has changed in generation V and the article is incorrect. Werdnae (talk) 05:17, 3 October 2011 (UTC)
There are no badge requirements. I've once traded something over with Surf just after getting the C-Gear before and was able to get on to Route 17 and 18. - Blazios talk 06:01, 3 October 2011 (UTC)

Black and White 2

On the description, it is referred to as "Hidden <TM number> <TM name>". Do we need redirects or anything? --Abcboy (talk) 16:35, 20 October 2012 (UTC)

PP Replenishment in Generations 5 and 6

The TM page says that "unlike in Generation V, when a Pokémon learns a move from a TM or HM by overwriting an old one, the new move is learned with full PP, instead of taking on the current PP of the forgotten move." However, the HM article says that "When a move is replaced by an HM, the HM move takes on the current PP of the replaced move until healed or replenished. The same also applies for replacing old moves with TMs." (thus retaining the same mechanic that Generation 5 had) Which variant is correct?

Also, in Generation 5, by "current PP of the forgotten move", is this statement meant as "the percentage of PP that the old move had"? For example, if you overwrote the move Fire Blast (having been reduced to 2 PP out of 5 PP) with the 15-PP Surf, would Surf have 40% of its usual PP (thus being 6 PP out of 15 PP)? Fenyx4 (talk) 18:52, 23 January 2014 (UTC)

The HM article may not have been updated with Generation VI mechanics, though I can't check to see if it truly is different in Gen VI. For your second question, it means exactly what it says: the current PP of the forgotten move, so if you overwrite 2 PP Fire Blast with Surf, Surf will have 2 PP. --It's Funktastic~!話してください 19:00, 23 January 2014 (UTC)


So I've been playing with FRLG, and I've hacked Fly to be Poison-type. To my surprise, it actually displayed proper sprite. I've been changing the type, and although we have yet to have HMs of most of the types, the sprite was still there. (??? uses Normal-type sprite, though). There was even a sprite for Bug-type move, although there was no Bug-type TM back then. Tried in Emerald, but sprites seem to be hardcoded, unlike here. Eridanus (talk) 08:08, 10 August 2014 (UTC)


The Trivia says Rock Smash is the only HM move with a Unique type among them, But Fly is the only Flying type HM move. --Benayla (talk) 03:58, 7 July 2015 (UTC)

Defog is a Flying type HM move. Adamws (talk) 04:04, 7 July 2015 (UTC)

Sinnoh part

I wanted to add the fact that Flash was removed in the Sinnoh HMs, but I can't seem to incorporate it properly. Is anyone willing to incorporate this info in? Qwertyxp2000 (talk) 05:20, 27 August 2017 (UTC)

what does "completing the games" mean?

For HGSS, you claim that Rock Climb is required for completing the games, even though you can't get Rock Climb until after the credits have rolled. Pikachu210 (talk) 22:03, 17 October 2019 (UTC)

You need Rock Climb to reach Red.--ForceFire 04:41, 18 October 2019 (UTC)