1,632
edits
Talk:Shellder (Pokémon): Difference between revisions
From Bulbapedia, the community-driven Pokémon encyclopedia.
Jump to navigationJump to search
→Leech like properties.: Argument for leech. and Argument for Venom before, not after biting Slowpoke.
(→Leech like properties.: Argument for leech. and Argument for Venom before, not after biting Slowpoke.) |
|||
| Line 36: | Line 36: | ||
Ok, I can cite right now that the Eelektrik articles lists the leech a possibility with no more "evidence" then shellder. Pokémon are not cut and dry, and unless we interrogate the Game Freak staff, we likely won't know for sure which Pokémon are based on what, if any plant or animal. We had this same problem on the Chestnaught article with people saying it can't be based off any animals other than hedgehogs just because that is what Chestpin is based on. [[User:Yamitora1|Yamitora1]] ([[User talk:Yamitora1|talk]]) 10:22, 19 January 2014 (UTC) | Ok, I can cite right now that the Eelektrik articles lists the leech a possibility with no more "evidence" then shellder. Pokémon are not cut and dry, and unless we interrogate the Game Freak staff, we likely won't know for sure which Pokémon are based on what, if any plant or animal. We had this same problem on the Chestnaught article with people saying it can't be based off any animals other than hedgehogs just because that is what Chestpin is based on. [[User:Yamitora1|Yamitora1]] ([[User talk:Yamitora1|talk]]) 10:22, 19 January 2014 (UTC) | ||
:Where is the evidence that Shellder is attempting to consume Slowpoke instead of merely latching on, though? I'm sorry, but to me merely latching on to something and not letting go does not describe leech-like properties. Leeches are worm-like creatures that suck blood, while Shellder is clam-like and has been stated to each scraps of Slowbro's meals. Shellder has a symbiotic relationship with its host, while most leeches certainly do not. Eelektrik,on the other hand, has the serpentine leech shape, jaw shape, and behavior to an extent. I'm not going to sit here and say that Shellder cannot possibly be based on a leech, but that the evidence is really weak and hazy, and therefore very unlikely. Not everything that latches onto something else is a leech, there are many other kinds of parasites - including a clam with a parasitic lifestage. The wording of this is also somewhat poor. "Interestingly" is an opinion, and really shouldn't be here. And most of the evidence after that is very circumstantial and a little speculative, since as I said there's no evidence that Shellder is trying to ''consume'' Slowpoke. If we want to include leeches, it should be based on what evidence we do have. Which would just be the parasitic relationship, or "Its parasitic relationship to Slowpoke may be inspired by leeches" and ''possibly'' "This is also supported by its beneficial toxins". Since some leeches do produce a toxin in their saliva that is useful to the host. [[User:Crystal Talian|<span style="color:#9F00C5">Crystal</span>]] [[User talk:Crystal Talian|<span style="color:#FF00FF">Talian</span>]] 19:13, 19 January 2014 (UTC) | :Where is the evidence that Shellder is attempting to consume Slowpoke instead of merely latching on, though? I'm sorry, but to me merely latching on to something and not letting go does not describe leech-like properties. Leeches are worm-like creatures that suck blood, while Shellder is clam-like and has been stated to each scraps of Slowbro's meals. Shellder has a symbiotic relationship with its host, while most leeches certainly do not. Eelektrik,on the other hand, has the serpentine leech shape, jaw shape, and behavior to an extent. I'm not going to sit here and say that Shellder cannot possibly be based on a leech, but that the evidence is really weak and hazy, and therefore very unlikely. Not everything that latches onto something else is a leech, there are many other kinds of parasites - including a clam with a parasitic lifestage. The wording of this is also somewhat poor. "Interestingly" is an opinion, and really shouldn't be here. And most of the evidence after that is very circumstantial and a little speculative, since as I said there's no evidence that Shellder is trying to ''consume'' Slowpoke. If we want to include leeches, it should be based on what evidence we do have. Which would just be the parasitic relationship, or "Its parasitic relationship to Slowpoke may be inspired by leeches" and ''possibly'' "This is also supported by its beneficial toxins". Since some leeches do produce a toxin in their saliva that is useful to the host. [[User:Crystal Talian|<span style="color:#9F00C5">Crystal</span>]] [[User talk:Crystal Talian|<span style="color:#FF00FF">Talian</span>]] 19:13, 19 January 2014 (UTC) | ||
:: I don't know why you wrote that message in the edit summary, the venom thing and the leech thing were two separate things entirely. Plus I had posted on your talk page to explain the reasoning for the edit, after the edit... so telling me to wait for a response was a little too late in that regard. Still, let me address everything here on this talk page. | |||
:: Shellder gains the Jaw shape of a leech, albeit while in a shell. As for the trying to consume part, I am not sure if you have access to any of the 3D games, but watch Slowbro and the shellder in Stadium and more recent XY's Pokémon-Amie. In stadium the shellder occasionally chomps down hard, causing the slowbro to jolt up in pain. I believe this is also present in Snap as well, where Slowbro is tormented by the Shellder's Malicious chomps shortly after evolving. In Pokémon-Amie, it also does a chewing motion, which, although this doesn't result in the same jolt as Stadium/Snap animated, it still shows it has the ability to chew on its host. Still, as I said in stadium/snap it was much more violent/comedic looking. Even if it doesn't want to Fully consume the host in some way, it still illustrates behaviors that make it seem likely. | |||
:: Now for the most part, most of the things you are calling into question were pieces added to the leech thing which were only recently added by myself. The part about leeches, parasites and crabs was up for months before I added a little more body to it based on research on leeches and learning they are more than parasites but also predators that prey on invertebrates. | |||
:: Also, I don't believe I was the one who added the "Interestingly enough" part to that description, that really isn't my flair to typically add things like that. Even if it was me, that only means it needs better wording so that it doesn't seem to imply opinion. Depending on how you read context, anything could be an opinion. | |||
:: Not everything is black and white, cut and dry. People view leeches as parasites, but that is only one side of a multi-sided story. People think maggots are disgusting, but they are quite beneficial. You can have a festering wound, put maggots into it and they will clean it better then most modern day medicines without the risk of something becoming a resistant strain. Its all in the matter of perception, humans cast judgement onto things and decide its the law, but scratch beneath the surface and you can find details you wouldn't normally comprehend in a certain fashion. The word Symbiotic is thrown around a lot with these two, but at the end of the day Shellder is still refereed to as a parasite. | |||
::: As for the Venom side of things, You seem to be misunderstanding the context of Slowking's dexes. | |||
:::Slowking Pokédex Entry: | |||
:::*Silver: '''When''' its head was bitten, toxins entered '''Slowpoke's head''' and unlocked an extraordinary power. | |||
:::*PDPt: '''Being bitten''' by Shellder gave it intelligence comparable to that of award-winning scientists. | |||
::: The Dex says "Slowpoke's head" not Slowking. If it was Slowking's head then the shellder would already be in its spiraled form. | |||
::: You are stating that Shellder is in its Spiral Shelled state when this happens. No, It is regular Shellder until the Evolution. It bites onto Slowpoke's head as a regular Shellder, Venom surges into Slowpoke's brain, it unlocks the great power and then they evolve. Afterwards, the Shellder's shell becomes spiraled and just like a bee stinger left to itself will keep pumping venom long after the sting and the bee's death, Shellder keeps chomping down and releasing venom, especially when Slowking yawns. | |||
::: The radioactive/bio-engineered spider that bites Peter Parker, gave him his powers and allowed him to become Spider Man was not radioactive/bio-engineered because it bit Peter, that is what it was beforehand. [[User:Yamitora1|Yamitora1]] ([[User talk:Yamitora1|talk]]) 00:00, 20 January 2014 (UTC) | |||
