Bulbapedia - User contributions [en]

Talk:History of the Pokémon world

2015-03-18T07:05:00Z

MofoMan2000: /* Whats with the Humans land on the moon */

==Shaping this article==
I think this article needs to be redesigned... "history" is a bit of a general term - there are differences between the histories in different parts on the cannon (games, anime and different manga series have contradicted each other several times in the past). We need to make rules to decide what goes in and what doesn't...--[[User:ElectAbuzzzz|ElectAbuzzzz]] 12:37, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

It may not even be possible to write such an article since there is not much historical information, not to mention a good part of it is legend. (Then again, in this world it seems legends are generally true.) - [[User:Zhen Lin|振霖]][[User talk:Zhen Lin|T]] 15:17, 13 April 2007 (UTC)
:I think it's more accurate to say that the Pokemon that ''appear'' in legend are true. There's no solid evidence to say that the Sinnoh Myths aren't simply that: Myth. I feel that until Nintendo officially confirms that Arceus did in fact create the Universe, or any other legend, such as Regigigas moving the continents, we should treat them purely as myth and/or theory, and not include them with articles dealing with fact, such as this Timeline.--[[User:Dual|Dual]] 03:11, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

The timeline must have another sub article--[[User:Joshuamanimtim2|Snorlax]] 10:30, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Should the spinoff games (Colosseum, XD, Ranger, Snap...) fit in anywhere? There's not a lot of evidence linking those to the handheld games... is there any way to put them in? --[[User:Kayube|Kayube]] 04:09, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
:I doubt it. There is no indication that any events in the non-handheld games are canon to the basic storyline, so there's no real point to including it here. On another note, it's my personal opinion that this needs to be moved to a different article, because there isn't much of the history that has been confirmed; most of it, as has been mentioned, is legend and theory. Regardless, I'm going to try to clean this up a bit and Wikify it some. [[User:Vekter|Vekter]] 15:40, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
::Well, the Pokemon Ranger games seem to actually reference events from the games (and also is the reason why {{p|Manaphy}} even exists in the main games.) If we aren't going to count the Ranger games are canon to the basic storyline, then we shouldn't count Manaphy as canon, either, since that's the only EVENT pokemon in the main series that debuted in a side game/spinoff game rather than in the main game series. Besides, since we can't transfer any prior gen pokemon onto the R/S/E/FR/LG game packs, Pokemon Colosseum is currently the only legit way to even ACQUIRE Celebi (though this is only in the Japanese version), and it (as well as it's sequel, Gale of darkness) is also the only OTHER legit way to acquire Ho-Oh and Lugia if you didn't get the Mystic tickets in the Emerald/FR/LG versions. now, for games like Mystery dungeon, yes, those SHOULDN'T be counted as canon in there, since that's an Alt universe. [[User:Weedle Mchairybug|Weedle Mchairybug]] 13:04, 11 July 2008 (UTC)
:::What should NOT be considered canon is all this fan-made BS about Pokemon populations decreasing, when the unobtainables came into being, how Doduo/Dodrio came to have multiple heads, etc. -- [[User:Umbee|Umbee]] 22:01, 2 October 2008 (UTC)
::::Do you think the "Contemporary History" should be moved to a new article called "Timeline of events in the games"? This article is supposed to be about how the Pokémon Universe developed, not what happened in it afterwards.

== Can anyone state where it was said that the S.S. Tidal was created in the 1990s? ==

I need to know because the article said it was created in that time period, and yet I don't really recall the games even stating that it was created in the 1990s (In fact, I don't even recall it even mentioning the date of when it was created at all).
:Don't forget to sign your comment with four tildes <nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>. On to the subject i agree there is no mention of when it was built nor is there mention of its age and assume its age from the release date. So Any suggestions on what to do with it? [[User:Pterodactal|Pterodactal]] 07:00, 16 September 2007 (UTC)
::I seem to recall the ship was under construction during the journey portion of [[Pokémon Ruby and Sapphire|R/S/]][[Pokémon Emerald|E]]. [[User:Bardock|Bar]][[User_Talk:Bardock|dock]] 12:33, 27 January 2009 (UTC)

I created it. Sorry. But we could leave it as it is. [[User:Joshuamanimtim2|K.J.Boring]] 11:31, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

== Generation III ==

It should be sometime BEFORE Generation II and AFTER Generation I because Generation II states that STEEL is a NEWLY discovered type, and Generation III has steel types... <sc>'''[[User:Optimus35|Agent]] [[User talk:Optimus35|#448]]'''</sc> <sc>[http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/w/index.php?limit=50&title=Special%3AContributions&contribs=user&target=Optimus35&namespace=0&year=&month=-1 ☆] | [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZPMmUEHFIU ♥]</sc> This will put you off eating for life! 12:30, 23 November 2007 (UTC)
:Here's how the Generations go in chronological order (This isn't merely fanon, it is supported by evidence from the various canons.)

Generation I→Generation III→→→Generation II→Generation IV

→=short time in betweeen →→→=long time in between

[[User:Shiny Noctowl|Shiny]][[User talk:Shiny Noctowl|?]][[Special:Contributions/Shiny Noctowl|!]] 13:22, 23 November 2007 (UTC)
:: This really puzzles me - I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just confused by this: how exactly are Generations in that order? I don't even understand how Generations I and II could have their timelines connected with III and IV... Ie: what is the canonical proof for this? (not because I'd doubt it - rather I'd love to know it, please) [[User:Sipulichu|Sipulichu]] 20:51, 31 July 2008 (UTC)

:I don't think that Steel is newly DISCOVERED type. It's just newly classified type out of those we actually had (the Steel Pokémon could be identified as Rock Pokémon before). The text in game may be mistranslated, since American Pokémon media loves to give us a shit about "new" Pokémon. --[[User:Maxim|Maxim]] 13:26, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

== Moon Stone ==

What about "The Moon Stone"?
Of [[EP006|Clefairy and the Moon Stone]]:

"Seymour theorizes this is because both '''the Pokémon came from outer space''', and '''the Moon Stone was their spacecraft''' - which means the Stone belongs to the Pokémon, and the humans must leave it alone."

[[User:Mateussf|Mateussf]] 21:28, 3 December 2007 (UTC)

That was only in the animé. As far as I know, the whole "Pokémon came from outer-space" thing was never mentioned in any game.--[[User:Pokencyclopedia|Pokencyclopedia]] 23:59, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

Except for MAYBE Deoxys and the Clefairy family

~~Weedle McHairybug~~

How about Jirachi? Comet=Outer Space --'''[[User:Theryguy512|Theryguy]][[User talk:Theryguy512|5]][[User:Theryguy512/Contribution Page|1]][[User:Theryguy512/Similarities|2]]''' 18:52, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

thanks for pointing him out, Theryguy512.
~~Weedle McHairybug~~

IIRC there is an NPC in the Space Center that mentions the theory in Generation III. I believe I've also seen this mentioned in other games, though I may be mistaken. [[User:Vekter|Vekter]] 15:43, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

:Lunatone and Solrock appearantly came from outer space as well. ~[[User:SaturnYoshi|'''$aturn''']][[User:SaturnYoshi|'''¥oshi''']] [[User talk:SaturnYoshi|THE VOICES]] 14:40, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

The theory is explicitly stated by a Lass outside of Brock's gym in Gen. I and Gen. III. That Clefairy are aliens. Deoxys is also stated to be an alien virus that came to Earth on a meteorite. Kyurem was believed to be an alien before his status as Reshiram and Zekrom's original body was discovered. Solrock and Lunatone are also stated to be extraterrestrials and Elgyem and Beheeyem are based off of the 1949 Roswell, New Mexico incident so even though it's never stated outright, they're aliens as well. I personally think that the arrival of Pokémon from outer space should be included. --[[User:BlackButterfree|BlackButterfree]] ([[User talk:BlackButterfree|talk]]) 04:53, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

== Where did the bird trio go? Sinnoh. ==

Look at this, the legendary bird trio ( Articuno, Zapdos, Moltres ) is revealed to roam Sinnoh in Pokémon Platnum. These three, are missing in the GSC games (they can't be found in Kanto). So, they might have flown to Sinnoh. [[User:Joshuamanimtim2|K.J.Boring]] 04:55, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
:Maybe if someone actually says that in-game. Otherwise, it's speculation.--[[User:Urutapu|Ｌｏｖｅはドコ？]] ([[User talk:Urutapu|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Urutapu|contribs]]) 05:03, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
:::No one says that those are the same birds though. The Frontier brains afterall have legendary birds aswell.
Forgot to sign name--[[User:Outrage DD|Outrage DD]] 23:26, 3 October 2008 (UTC)
::::In the anime as well, it's shown that there are multiple versions of legendaries (even in the same frame, a mother and baby Lugia come to mind). ←{'''[[User:Berrymaster|Berrymaster]]|[[User_talk:Berrymaster|Talk]]|[[Special:Contributions/Berrymaster|Contrib]]'''}→ 23:28, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

==Clean-Up, Please?==

Going through this article, all I see is fan speculation and unusual conclusions. I for one would like to see some evidence of these claims, as many of them see totally made-up. For example: What connection to Kyogre and Manaphy have? And "herds" of Latios and Latias? As far as I remember, it's one for each player. I wouldn't say there were "herds" of Mewtwo, would you?
[[User:Me, Hurray!|Me, Hurray!]] 03:05, 27 November 2008 (UTC)

:Actually, the "Herds" of Latios and Latias was stated in the Pokedex Entries of Latios and Latias. Don't believe me? Try looking at the pokedex portion of their article. [[User:Weedle Mchairybug|Weedle Mchairybug]] 03:12, 27 November 2008 (UTC)
::[[Kyogre]] and [[Manaphy]] were both in Ranger of The Sea Temple ( i think thats what it was called)[[User:DCM|DCM]][[User talk:DCM|((Shut the **** up]][[Special:Contributions/DCM|Spy on My Edits))]]
::Mewtwo is the only successful clone (attempted by humans) of a Pokémon as far as we know. And we're 100% certain that he's the only Mewtwo out there. [[User:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|R.A. Hunter B.]] 03:25, 27 November 2008 (UTC)
::And in the case of the games, it's also the only cloned pokemon, Period [even then, lab notes hinted that it wasn't even a clone {the whole "Mew Gave Birth" thing comes to mind}.] [[User:Weedle Mchairybug|Weedle Mchairybug]] 00:17, 29 November 2008 (UTC)
:: Okay, okay, but I still think these should be referenced in the article. It is still true that most of the article is mere specualtion, however. [[User:Me, Hurray!|Me, Hurray!]] 04:32, 27 November 2008 (UTC)
:::Actually, I doubt that half of it is speculation. Most of it is from the games. Yeah, some of it is guessing for the dates, but that is why they have a large number of years separating the different sections, as the games don't give specific dates, except for that Arceus created the Pokémon universe. [[User:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|R.A. Hunter B.]] 17:15, 27 November 2008 (UTC)
:::: Because everything mentioned in the games is meant to be taken literally. Yes. I see it now. Silly me.[[User:Me, Hurray!|Me, Hurray!]] 20:41, 27 November 2008 (UTC)
Sorry. I didn't mean for it to seem like that. When things are typed, they always sound different in the mind of somebody else. [[User:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|R.A. Hunter B.]] 00:16, 29 November 2008 (UTC)
:: I'm sorry, I strayed away from the point. My only problem is that there is no evidence and there are no citations in the artical. It's alright pointing things out here in the talk page, but if there's no evidence in the artical itself then I don't think it meets certain standards. I'm really just requesting evidence.
:::We can't really cite the games, which is why there aren't any citations at the moment. [[User:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|R.A. Hunter B.]] 21:22, 2 December 2008 (UTC)
::::You can ''sorta'' cite the games. Who to talk to and where to see what's said. '''[[User:TTEchidna|''TTE'']][[User talk:TTEchidna|chidna]]''' 04:14, 7 December 2008 (UTC)
:::::True. But I think the citing that Me, Hurray is talking about is links and stuff. Or at least very specific descriptions of where they come from. Links we can't do for games, but yeah, I guess it would take some time, but we could find all of the people who tell us the random info. [[User:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|R.A. Hunter B.]] 04:20, 7 December 2008 (UTC)
:::::: Mentioning who gives the information in-game sounds like a satasfactory measure to me. at least then the information can be varified and proven correct. [[User:Me, Hurray!|Me, Hurray!]] 16:46, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

==Rotom==

it is never said that Rotom was made in the 70's, infact I taught [[Pluto]] discovered it in the 50's, so I think we should leave it blank until Platinum's out in english [[User:Ultamatecharizard|Ultamate]][[User Talk:Ultamatecharizard|Charizard]] 16:49, 8 December 2008 (UTC)
:I only knew he discovered it. In his youth. I didn't know there was a date involved. [[User:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|R.A. Hunter B.]] 22:25, 8 December 2008 (UTC)
::I still don't get who put that in, I mean it would be diffrent it was ever said but I looked Rotom's page and it didn't say anything [[User:Ultamatecharizard|Ultamate]][[User Talk:Ultamatecharizard|Charizard]]
:::All you have to do is go through the editing history. [[User:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|R.A. Hunter B.]] 20:31, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

==Multiple Mew!?==
Alright, who said that Mew were plentiful soon after the creation of the Pokémon world? And how does anyone know that [[Mew (Lucario and the Mystery of Mew)|this Mew]] is different from [[Mew (Mewtwo Strikes Back)|that Mew]]? It could just be a different voice actor. [[User:Palkiajosh|パルキアJosh]] 23:23, 9 December 2008 (UTC)
*Ok, about the reason why Mew from Mewtwo Strikes Back being different from the Mew from Lucario and the Mystery of Mew, it's for a couple of reasons. Yes, the voice doesn't necessarily mean much, however, MSB's Mew's Japanese VA was definitely in the 8th Movie as he (she? I don't really know the VA's gender) was the one who voiced Sir Aaron in that Movie. I mean, why would they give Mew a different VA (assuming that it IS the same one) if it's original VA is still very much available? Plus, the one from Movie 1 was very far from Kanto, and If this were the same mew, it would spend most of it's time inside of a Lake/Jungle than in a deciduous forest with a [[Tree of Beginning|Tree-like Rock formation]], not to mention that MSB's Mew lives a considerably far distance from Kanto, or heck, any of the regions that have been seen thus far, while LatMoM's Mew was located, if not in Kanto, then just barely beyond the border. As for the multiple parts, I'm guessing the fossilized remains of a Mew, as well as it being a genetic ancestor to every pokemon seems to answer that question.) [[User:Weedle Mchairybug|Weedle Mchairybug]] 23:36, 9 December 2008 (UTC)
Don't forget that the first Mew was seen to be sleeping underwater, possibly for a long time, untill Mewtwo unleashed his power on the world, creating storms and kidnapping the Nurse Joy of the city. The most recent Mew, was seen to have been connected to the Tree of Beginning, so it should be assumed Mew can't be away from it for long periods of time (longer than seen in the movie). And it and the Tree are so closely connected, when Mew would be damaged in the first movie, the Tree would also sustain damage. And the first Mew is also living in the Johto area, not Kanto. [[User:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|R.A. Hunter B.]] 21:54, 10 December 2008 (UTC)
Mew is the ancestor of all life. A being cannot breed with itself. Thus-multiple Mews-Mtn_Otter

== Lugia did what? ==

Who ever said Lugia actually created the 3 birds? just because it's the master trio doesn't mean it created them. --'''[[User:InuMimi|いぬ]][[User talk:InuMimi|みみ]]''' 23:42, 16 December 2008 (UTC)
:Well........now thats up to interpretation. I say no[[User:DCM|DCM]][[User talk:DCM|((曲奇饼妖怪]][[Special:Contributions/DCM|Spy on My Edits))]]
::I agree. It doesn't say anywhere that he created them. It just says that a Lugia has the power to destroy (Pokédex entries) or save the world (movie), depending on the situation. It only has control over the birds and their powers, and I think they only obey him out of respect for a higher being. [[User:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|R.A. Hunter B.]] 16:13, 18 December 2008 (UTC)

== Cleanup! ==

This article is really very well done as it sums up everything so those supposed continuity errors are straingtened out (such as the "Which came first? Arceus or Mew?" paradox). But I really think it needs a cleanup. All it has are random dot points on Pokemon that aren't related. Clean it up!
Also, fan assumptions should be excluded! It's annoying to see speculation assumed as fact. [[User:Bttsstewart|Bttsstewart]] 15:30, 18 December 2008 (UTC)
:Well, we've been trying to do that for a while. And if you want it cleaned up, then don't just tell people to do it. You need to do something too. [[User:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|R.A. Hunter B.]] 16:10, 18 December 2008 (UTC)
::There really isn't a paradox concerning Arceus and Mew. It is ''believed'' (according to Dex entries) that Mew is the ancestor of Pokémon, but it clearly states in the DPPt origin story that Arceus was born before every other Pokémon (before the universem even). Arceus created Mew, ta-dah! And like [[User:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|R.A. Hunter B.]] said, you can't just tell people to do things you want done. [[User:LordArceus|'''Lord''']][[User talk:LordArceus|'''Arc''']][[Special:Contributions/LordArceus|'''eus''']] 16:12, 18 December 2008 (UTC)
I've had an interesting theory, which could solve the Arceus/Mew paradox. Arceus may have created the universe, but what if Mew came around before the universe was created, and Arceus sort of descended from it? Also, Mew is the ANSCESTOR of all Pokémon, not necassarily their creator. So if Arceus created Dialga and Palkia and the Lake Trio, then they are still anscestors of Mew, because Arceus is.

Please remember to sign comments. I realise that there's no Mew/Arceus paradox, not really. I just mean this article can definitively solve the arguing. (I've seen A LOT of arguing on the subject.) [[User:Bttsstewart|Bttsstewart]] 14:33, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

To answer above from Rocket Admin Hunter Blade & LordArceus): I didn't think I was 'qualified' enough to contribute to the cleanup. I though you sort of had to be in the webiste 'inner ring'. Haha. I guess that's silly. I've just had a look and I think it's fine as it is. It's just the allignment of the dot points that's a little dodgy. [[User:Bttsstewart|Bttsstewart]] 14:42, 14 January 2009 (UTC)
:The only "qualification" you need, is the ability to not get carried away and screw everything up. Other than that, you should be able to do a lot, such as grammar mistakes, spelling, punctuation, and moving text to the correct sections. [[User:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|R.A. Hunter B.]] 22:11, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

== Celebi, Jirachi and Shaymin ==

Where did the "theory" come around supposing that Celebi, Jirachi and Shaymin were all born at the same time, and after the invention of the Unown writing system? There's no evidence to support this, so why even include it? [[User:Taromon777|Taromon777]] 22:55, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

== Pictures ==

I think it would improve this article a great deal of some pictures were included. It would give people more of an idea of what they were reading about. If anyone has any pictures of ancient Sinnoh region tapestries, or anything similar, be sure to add it to the article! [[User:Taromon777|Taromon777]] 22:55, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

== Kyogre Problem ==

How could Kyogre have expanded the sea with the help of Manaphy and Lugia when it went to sleep millions of years before, and wasn't woken up again until the events of Generation III? I think that, considering the fact that the Pokémon world is very similar to our own, the sea was probably created the same way that Earth's sea was, and that the theory of it being created by Pokémon is simply a legend. There is definately no archaelogical evidence that it was expanded by Pokémon! Maybe, until we are certain, we shouldn't mention how the sea was created like it is fact. [[User:Taromon777|Taromon777]] 22:55, 23 January 2009 (UTC)
:Please sign your edits. [[User:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|R.A. Hunter B.]] 19:39, 23 December 2008 (UTC)
::This is all based off Dex entries and such. Kyogre created the oceans, not Manaphy or Lugia[[User:DCM|DCM]][[User talk:DCM|((曲奇饼妖怪]][[Special:Contributions/DCM|Spy on My Edits))]]

==Writing System==
The article claims that the first writing system was created 1500 years before Generation 1. If this is based on present time, the first writing system was created in 500 AD. I haven't done any research yet, but I'm just noting that in our world, writing was created in about 2500 BC (Egyptians). This would be 4500 years before the present. [[User:Firemaker|Firemaker]] 23:29, 3 January 2009 (UTC)
Also the information about the pokemon (Mamoswine, Farfetch'd, Magikarp); is that true? [[User:Firemaker|Firemaker]] 23:29, 3 January 2009 (UTC)
:Writing first came about around 3400-3000 BC. It's still disputed wether Egypt or Mesopotamia had the oldest writing system. And for your second question, yes. Mamoswine are based off of woolly mammoths, so their history is almost the same as in our world. Farfetch'd have been mentioned somewhere, for their history, but I can't remember. And then Magikarp are the easiest. Many of their TCG Pokédex info boxes talk about it. [[User:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|R.A. Hunter B.]] 23:48, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

== Gigas? ==

Didn't IT make the three, not humans? '''[[User:TTEchidna|''TTE'']][[User talk:TTEchidna|chidna]]''' 08:16, 1 May 2009 (UTC)
:It says that? I haven't been paying attention then... They came around naturally, so nobody really created them, not even Regigigas. Although Platinum DOES say he did, the problem is that the Pt. Dex entry goes against what the Gen. III Dex entries say. [[User:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|R.A. Hunter B.]] 18:48, 1 May 2009 (UTC)
::I think it says in the Gen III Pokédex entries that humans created the first three Regis. Regigigas, on the other hand, came into being naturally, and helped to shape the continents. That's what I always though anyway. [[User:Taromon777|Taromon777]] 19:55, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
:::I read that Gigas did the continents, but it became too strong so humans made the Regis and used them as keys to seal it away. Of course, that may have come from this site.... — [[User talk:The dark lord trombonator|THE TROM]] — 08:23, 30 May 2009 (UTC)

::::That's the thing... most of the stuff on Bulba is from other things here... but in this case, it's hard to decide. Because how can it control the Regis if they were made by humans? Either mind control because they're so similar, or the humans made three original Regis, and then Gigas made more. '''[[Team Rocket|R.A.]] [[User:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|Hunter]] [[User Talk:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|Blade]]''' 23:16, 30 May 2009 (UTC)
:::I'm not seeing where in the Gen III Pokedex entries it says that humans created them... Registeel and Regirock's say that humans sealed them away, but have nothing that I can see about humans creating them. Unless I am misreading horribly, that part of the timeline needs to be changed. - [[User:C.Olimar788|C.Olimar788]] 21:52, 2 January 2010 (UTC)
:::The Pokedexes definitely don't say that humans made the Regi.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 21:26, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

== Prehistory and Recent History ==

I personally think this article needs to be either fixed up, deleted, or at least protected, especially the Prehistory and Recent History sections. I mean, at least part of those sections are true, but the rest of it is rubbish. Who ever said the Regis were made in their respective ages? Part of it has nothing to do with Pokémon: why is Apollo 11 even in here? I just want your opinion. [[User:Leafstorm151|Leafstorm151]] 18:26, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

:Because. The Pokémon world has some things tied in with ours. And in the Gen I games and their remakes, a guy talks about buying a color TV just to see Neil Armstrong land on the moon. And the Regis is most likely speculation, but at the same time not. '''[[Team Rocket|R.A.]] [[User:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|Hunter]] [[User Talk:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|Blade]]''' 19:02, 6 June 2009 (UTC)
::Regis were made by Gigas then Gigas was sealed and the Regis got exported to Hoenn to keep them away. '''[[User:TTEchidna|''TTE'']][[User talk:TTEchidna|chidna]]''' 00:50, 7 June 2009 (UTC)

== What about Damos? ==

It is stated that {{p|Arceus}} "FIRST" fall into never ending sleep BEFORE the first humans appeared ehh...but in the case of Movie12 Arceus meets Damos, a human, what about that?.....I mean that the first humans appeared after Arceus fall into never ending sleep then....i think we should change that section..."[[Sceptile (Pokémon)|☆]][[User:AngelGuardian|Angel]][[User talk:AngelGuardian|Guardian]][[Brendan (game)|☆]]" 07:33, 8 June 2009 (UTC)
:Speculation=no. Until we see movie 12 nothing gets added.--[[User:RexRacer|'''Rex]][[User talk:RexRacer|Racer''']] 07:35, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

So you mean that whole story of Movie12, of Damos or whatever happens was all because of manga? i mean you get all the information on manga?"[[Sceptile (Pokémon)|☆]][[User:AngelGuardian|Angel]][[User talk:AngelGuardian|Guardian]][[Brendan (game)|☆]]" 07:40, 8 June 2009 (UTC)
:Until Movie 12 gets released there can still be doubts. Just wait. I'm sure everything will be explained in time. '''[[User:TTEchidna|''TTE'']][[User talk:TTEchidna|chidna]]''' 07:44, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

Arceus, as the creator of the space-time continuum, could logically travel through time in a manner similar it Celibi or Dialga. Also Arceus may have created clones of itself to manage the world while it is asleep.-Mtn_otter

== Whats with the Humans land on the moon ==

Is this Just for fun, because it has no relation with pokemon at all... ---> [[User:223david|'''223''']][[Special:Contributions/223david|☆]][[User talk:223david|'''Dåv]d''']]''' 12:29, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

:If you've EVER played R/B/Y, or FRLG, you'd know. An old guy in the [[Pewter Museum of Science]] mentions getting a color TV just for that moment. '''[[Team Rocket|R.A.]] [[User:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|Hunter]] [[User Talk:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|Blade]]''' 16:24, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

::oh.... never played anything other than gen 4 :P ---> [[User:223david|'''223''']][[Special:Contributions/223david|☆]][[User talk:223david|'''Dåv]d''']]''' 02:30, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

:::Well then, now you know. '''[[Team Rocket|R.A.]] [[User:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|Hunter]] [[User Talk:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|Blade]]''' 02:31, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

:: Incidentally, the model of the space shuttle Colombia was retconned out of RBY through FireRed/LeafGreen after it was destroyed in reality. Just a fun fact. That's probably mentioned somewhere on this wiki. [[User:MofoMan2000|MofoMan2000]] ([[User talk:MofoMan2000|talk]]) 07:04, 18 March 2015 (UTC)

== Pictures! ==

I just added some pictures to the article, relevant to each era in the history of the Pokémon World. It makes it look a lot more interesting, don't you think? [[User:Taromon777|Taromon777]] 17:58, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

== Leaf ==

Shouldn't we remove Leaf from the article? HG/SS proves that Red's story is the canon one, and Leaf doesn't exist in Red's continuity because she never appeared during his quest. - [[User:Crystal Master|Crystal Master]]

:Absolutely not, unless we also remove {{ga|Kris}} due to non-interaction with {{ga|Gold}} in {{v2|Crystal}}. And we're not removing Kris. Just because Leaf doesn't appear in {{2v2|HeartGold|SoulSilver}} doesn't mean we should treat Leaf as if she never existed. --[[User:Shiningpikablu252|Shiningpikablu252]] 20:04, 19 September 2009 (UTC)

::I left Kris there just in case that for whatever reason you consider Pokémon Crystal to be canon rather than the remakes (which would still mean the Leaf isn't part of continuity).
::And even if you're going to assume that Leaf existed somewhere, the article is still wrong because she can't have had the same story she had in FR/LG. That would mean that both Red and Leaf had the same mom, the same house, the same rival and the same events within the same continuity, which makes no sense. If she was part of continuity, she would have a different role from Red's, like May and Dawn had in Brendan and Lucas' respective stories. Moreover, the article states that she defeated Green/Blue in the Pokémon League and became the new champion, which can't have happened, considering that Blue/Green states in HG/SS that the trainer who defeated him shortly after he became champion was Red, not Leaf.
::Lastly, the article should be about writing what we know that happened, not what might have happened. We know that Red's story is canon and Leaf's isn't, as they can't both happen in the same continuity. Therefore, we know that Leaf never appeared in continuity. That there's a Leaf somewhere in the established continuity is unfounded speculation, no matter how much some people want her to be part of it. - [[User:Crystal Master|Crystal Master]]

:::There are absolutely no acceptable grounds in removing all references to Leaf from the article. By removing parts from the article, you're trying to imply Leaf never existed to begin with, and for that to be true, FireRed/LeafGreen would have to have had only a male player character. Either that or there would have to have been no FireRed/LeafGreen (and if that were to be the case, there would be no HeartGold/SoulSilver either).

:::Those parts from the article you're trying to have removed in no way imply Leaf exists in HeartGold/SoulSilver; to have any area of the article imply any involvement from Leaf in HeartGold/SoulSilver, Leaf would have to be mentioned in one of the sections further below, and last I saw, there weren't any such mentions.

:::In conclusion: Leaf exists, and she always will. The fact HeartGold/SoulSilver doesn't mention her does not change that. Where Leaf is already mentioned, she should be. Where Leaf shouldn't be mentioned, she's already not. Trying to erase all traces of her existence from the article is akin to vandalism. --[[User:Shiningpikablu252|Shiningpikablu252]] 23:58, 19 September 2009 (UTC)

::::Oh, ok. So you weren't saying that there was a Leaf somewhere in the HG/SS timeline. My bad.
::::Anyway, correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this article about the timeline of the Pokémon world? Isn't it about making a recollection of the canonical events in the established continuity and making it the less ambiguous possible (ie: saying that "Brendan/May" became the Hoenn champion only because we don't have confirmation about which story is the canonical one, which is different from the case in FR/LG)?
::::Also, I thought that the most recent games that rewrite history take priority over the older ones. In the RSE section we say that the player calmed down Groudon and Kyogre with Rayquaza's help (as depicted in Emerald), not that s/he "stopped Groudon/Kyogre" (as depicted in Ruby and Sapphire respectively), because we use the most recent rewrite of the RSE story, Emerald, as canon. Likewise, shouldn't the GS remakes, which established that Red's story happened in the timeline but Leaf's didn't, take priority over FR/LG (as HG/SS are the most recent games)?
::::Edit: I'm not saying that Leaf doesn't exist. I'm saying that she doesn't exist in the continuity established by the overall timeline (if you believe HGSS or GSC), which I think this article is supposed to be about. - [[User:Crystal Master|Crystal Master]]

Perhaps instead of rewording the article to not mention Leaf, we reword the Gen III section to be ambiguous as to it's version:
:"After defeating Hoenn's eight Gym Leaders and, with the help of Steven and Wallace, calming Groudon and/or Kyogre after they are awakened by Team Magma/Team Aqua, respectively, he/she...."
AFAIK, Platinum's story is different from Pearl and Diamond, yet no mention of Giratina is made. Just keep the version ambiguous. [[User:Drake Clawfang|Drake Clawfang]] 03:07, 22 September 2009 (UTC)

:Drop me some drafts and I might consider it. I'd really want the text to securely take all player bases into consideration yet not allow possible relentless editing to try to make it look like one player base never existed in the canon. --[[User:Shiningpikablu252|Shiningpikablu252]] 03:19, 22 September 2009 (UTC)
::There's a draft right there, just replace the one sentence. [[User:Drake Clawfang|Drake Clawfang]] 03:24, 22 September 2009 (UTC)

== Protection?! ==

Thanks a lot! I've been working really hard on improving this article over the last few months and now it's been protected! What is the reasoning behind this? --[[User:Taromon777|'''''Taromon777''''']] '' 20:21, 27 September 2009 (UTC)

:Ever think about [http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/w/index.php?title=History_of_the_Pok%C3%A9mon_world&action=history checking]? '''[[Team Rocket|R.A.]] [[User:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|Hunter]] [[User Talk:Rocket Admin Hunter Blade|Blade]]''' 22:25, 27 September 2009 (UTC)
::Page now unlocked as both parties in the edit war reached a truce. —'''darklord[[User talk:The dark lord trombonator|trom]]''' 22:27, 27 September 2009 (UTC)
:::Yay, I can edit again now, thanks! Sorry if I came across a bit impolite before. --[[User:Taromon777|'''''Taromon777''''']] '' 10:24, 28 September 2009 (UTC)

== Colosseum and XD ==

how do we know it takes place 2 years after Gen 2 and 4?--'''[[User:Midnight Blue|Midnight]] [[User talk:Midnight Blue|''Blue'']]''' 18:33, 8 November 2009 (UTC)
:Not quite. According to the page, Colosseum takes place sometime between Generation I/III and II/IV, which makes sense, and then XD ''is'' supposed to be set quite a few years from Colosseum, although I don't know how we got "two years after Gen IV" specifically. [[User:Zesty Cactus|'''Zesty''']][[User talk:Zesty Cactus|'''Cactus''']] 19:04, 8 November 2009 (UTC)
Ok, thanx. I just thought someone just put that there without proof.--'''[[User:Midnight Blue|Midnight]] [[User talk:Midnight Blue|''Blue'']]''' 19:16, 8 November 2009 (UTC)

I know this is a VERY old topic, but I've been theorizing for a while that Ranger 1 and XD Take place between Gens 3 and 4, 3 Years after FRLG, and that Colosseum takes place 2 years before FRLG, and would like to submit this theory for consideration. --[[User:Hwrdjacob|Hwrdjacob]] ([[User talk:Hwrdjacob|talk]]) 05:24, 13 December 2014 (UTC)

For reference, I find it most likely that this ACII timeline is how it plays out: Colo.-(2 Years)->FRLG-(about a month)->Emerald/BoxR+S-(3 Years)->XD-(About 2 months or so)->HGSS-(At LEAST a month, but no more than a year)->Platinum/MyPokemonRanch/BattleRevolution-(Unknown timespan)->Black/White-(Two Years)->Black2/White2/DreamRadar-(A few months to a few years)->X/Y/Bank Since Im not all that knowlegable about Ranger, but it's enough to put Ranger1 around the time of XD and SoA/GS somewhere in Gen 4--[[User:Hwrdjacob|Hwrdjacob]] ([[User talk:Hwrdjacob|talk]]) 05:40, 13 December 2014 (UTC)

== Can anyone tell me how is it possible for Generation II and IV happened at the same time? ==
Its not possible because Jasmine is in the Sinnoh Region right?--[[User:Jason avelino|Jason avelino]] 10:42, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

:People just say that because they believe the odd-numbered generations take place at the same time. Yet there's zero proof of even that--no timeframes are ever stated for when the games that take place in either [[Hoenn]] or [[Sinnoh]] take place. For all we know, the [[Generation III]] Hoenn games takes place five years after [[Generation II]] and the [[Generation IV]] Sinnoh games take place 10 years further down the road, and yet the technology of their respective platforms allows them to trade freely with the remakes in their generation that do take place at the same time as their originals (addtionally, in Hoenn's case, it can even freely trade with two console games that take place years apart). Besides, where was it stated that the [[red Gyarados]] in the {{2v2|Diamond|Pearl}} intro is the one from the [[Lake of Rage]]? Right, nowhere. Yet people are using such a baseless assumption as evidence of the even-numbered generations taking place at or around the same time.

:The only times timeframes between two games are ever stated are the case between [[Generation I]] and [[Generation II]] being three years apart, and {{pkmn|Colosseum}} and {{pkmn|XD: Gale of Darkness}} being five years apart. The fact that both of the latter are compatible with all handheld Generation III games just goes to show that we don't know when the Hoenn and Sinnoh games take place, and that all assumptions of them taking place at the same time as the remakes in their repsective generations are baseless and shouldn't be trusted. --[[User:Shiningpikablu252|Shiningpikablu252]] 13:02, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

Ok thanks for answering my question...--[[User:Jason avelino|Jason avelino]] 05:35, 3 January 2010 (UTC)
:Timeframe for Sinnoh, by the way. Rowan returned from Kanto after four years of study with Oak. Red Gyarados specials were still airing on TV. Sinnoh's either during or shortly after the story of Johto. '''[[User:TTEchidna|''TTE'']][[User talk:TTEchidna|chidna]]''' 06:42, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

:Not necessarily. The Red Gyarados report had Mount Coronet in the background. That means the Red Gyarados couldn't have been in Johto. [[User:Edge578|Edge578]] 18:46, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

== Rayquaza from MINERALS? ==

Where the heck is this from? None of the Pokedexes mention it, and well, there aren't minerals in the ozone layer. They'd be much, much too heavy. Even if a volcano erupts and sprays ash (not minerals) into the air, it doesn't reach the ozone layer.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 21:28, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

== Regis Created By Humans? ==
Where does it say that the Regis were made by man? Or that they were made in the three eras (except for Regice)? In fact, Registeel is said to be "tens of thousands" of years old, according to the Pokedex, whereas the Iron Age was just 3,000 years ago. [[User:Plasma|Plasma]] 20:06, 9 May 2010 (UTC)

==Generation V==
Due to the fact that Cynthia and Looker mention Lucas/Dawn in passing, it can be safely assumed that Generation V takes place around the same time as XD. [[User:TorchicBlaziken|TorchicBlaziken]] ([[User_talk:TorchicBlaziken|talk]]•[[Special:Contributions/TorchicBlaziken|edits]]) 01:11, 18 October 2010 (UTC)
:Not necessarily. It can be assumed to take place after Platinum, but we have no idea exactly how long after. --[[User:AndyPKMN|AndyPKMN]] 12:06, 18 October 2010 (UTC)
Can we edit the Generation IV timeline by shifting the focus to Platinum's storyline rather than Diamond/Pearl with Platinum in parentheses? I believe Cynthia says something about the trainer who battled Giratina, which isn't in the DP Storyline. [[User:Pocketfanmk|Pocketfanmk]] 17:20, 13 November 2010 (UTC)
:I agree with pocketfanmk, considering that Platinum is the only game all three of the trio members and that the game is more detailed in all senses. As for Generation V... That's a tough one. [[User:Smashbrother101|Smashbrother101]] 00:24, 30 November 2010 (UTC)
: It's true. Because of the Gen V references we can assume that the Platinum Story is the canonical one, instead of the DP Story.line
About the time of each generation(like what he said:I-III--II-IV) is this because of the remakes of red and blue,
in Gen III and gold and silver, in Gen IV?. If it is, and if they will make a remake of ruby and sapphire in Gen V, then shouldn't it be I-III-V---II-IV? [[User:Phoenixon|Phoenixon]] 15:16, 28 February 2011 (UTC)

== More than one Regigigas? ==

''"Landmasses such as Mt. Coronet are created, and '''Regigigas move''' the continents, forming the regions,"''

Grammar suggests more than one, is this true or did someone make a typo?--[[User:Burgundy|Burg]][[User talk: Burgundy|undy]] 06:40, 30 January 2011 (UTC)
:I don't think it is suggesting that there were more than one. But I could be wrong. :/--[[User:Han Ji-Wan|Han Ji-Wan]] 07:12, 30 January 2011 (UTC)
::Well there are [[M11|multiple Regigigas]] [[DP129|in the anime]], so it may not be an error. '''X'''[[User:Vuvuzela2010|'''Vuvuzela2010''']]'''X''' 11:17, 30 January 2011 (UTC)
:::That bit seems fine, but the tense of that whole section is weird. Shouldn't it be in past tense? --[[User:Jda95|jda95]] 12:41, 30 January 2011 (UTC)
::::If there is only one Regigigas, it would be "''Regigigas moves''"--[[User:Burgundy|Burg]][[User talk: Burgundy|undy]] 16:17, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

== Basis of article ==

Is this article based on the games or the anime? --[[User:Fimbulwinter2012|☆'''FiMbUlWiNtEr2O|2'''☆]] 04:15, 28 February 2011 (UTC)
:I'm assuming a combination of both.. Why? --[[User:Han Ji-Wan|Han Ji-Wan]] 04:51, 28 February 2011 (UTC)
::The article says that it is based on the canon and the games, but it seems like a lot is from the movies. Aren't the movies part of the anime? And also there is a separate timeline for the anime. --[[User:Fimbulwinter2012|☆'''FiMbUlWiNtEr2O|2'''☆]] 22:34, 28 February 2011 (UTC)

== Article is Fan Speculation ==

Shouldn't the article be marked with that Togepi tag saying that this is only speculation?[[User:Jazama|Jazama]] 03:55, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
:And why should it? You need to give a real reason why [[User:Ataro|Ataro]] 04:00, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
:There are various things in there that are not officially confirmed. It is never officially said when the GameCube or Hoenn Games take place. All that is said is that Generation II takes place three years after Generation I, XD is five years after Colesseum, Generation IV is probably set around II, and that V takes place after II and IV. Until a timeline is ever given out, this is just speculation.[[User:Jazama|Jazama]] 05:59, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
::One more thing, the Pokedex is notoriously unreliable and myths are, by definition, religious stories, not accurate tales of history.[[User:Jazama|Jazama]] 06:22, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
After it says, "This information is based primarily on the mythology of both the Hoenn and Sinnoh regions," maybe there should be another sentence explaining that the myths are not necessarily true.[[User:Bulbamelia|Bulbamelia]] 01:29, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

== Missing Unova Details ==

the following details are missing in the list. however, it is difficult to place them into the timeline. should we mention somewhere that the placement is unknown? missing details:founding of unova region, dragon split into reshirm and zekrom, kyurem came down in a meteor, muskteer trio save pokemon during middle age, thundros and tornados fighting and landros calming them down. there should be more missing though - [[User:Pokeant|Pokeant]] 17:54, 13 April 2011 (UTC)

Shouldn't it also be noted that sometime between gens IV and V, Ghetsis somehow acquired the Adamant, Lustrous and Griseous orbs? [[User:Wind|Wind]] 21:19, 13 April 2011 (UTC)

And I think, the construction of the Marvelous Bridge? Village Bridge? "[[Arceus (Pokémon)|☆]][[User:AngelGuardian|Angel]][[User talk:AngelGuardian|Guardian]][[Arceus: To A Conquering Space-Time|☆]]" 04:42, 29 May 2011 (UTC)
:Can we include a unknown date section for the information with unspecific or unconfirmed date? -[[User:Pokeant|Pokeant]] 11:11, 29 May 2011 (UTC)

== Some issues with the timeline ==

''' ''Approximately two years after Generation II/Generation IV: '' '''
*''Cipher and Team Snagem return in the Orre Region, and create XD001, a supposedly unpurifiable Shadow Pokémon, but their plans are thwarted by Michael. Meanwhile, Dr. Kaminko and Chobin invent Robo Groudon and Robo Kyogre, and Professor Krane invents the purification chamber, where Shadow Pokémon can be purified more easily. ''
When was it ever stated that the Orre games even take place at the the same time as the Hoenn games? Orre looked like post-apocalyptic world.

''' ''Approximately 10 years after Generation II/Generation IV (Generation V): '' '''
*''The events of Black and White. ''
Why 10? If Black and White take place 10 years after Gen IV, then both Looker and Cythia have had botox. '''X'''[[User:Vuvuzela2010|'''Vuvuzela2010''']]'''X''' 02:03, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

:To answer your first question, it occuring around the same time as the Hoenn games/Kanto games was implied with the fact that it could trade to the Sevii Islands/Hoenn when linked up. [[User:Weedle Mchairybug|Weedle Mchairybug]] 02:34, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
::it is written as 10 years since the team rocket grunt in gsc/hgss makes an appearance and had a son. however, it can't be 10 years too. assuming he returned to unova the same year as gsc/hgss, it should roughly be 5 years. since from my memory, the overworld sprite of the son is a kid (i think) and so should not even be 10 years old. therefore, 5 should be a good approximation in my opinion. '''maybe another source mentioned it takes place roughly 10 years later?''' -[[User:Pokeant|Pokeant]] 03:32, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

== "A meteor breaks up a Pokémon World Pangaea, and makes all the regions"??? ==

does this belong to the anime history instead of here? it is not stated in the games a meteor breaks up the region. istead regigigas is the one that pulls the continents... i think this should go to the anime list. -[[User:Pokeant|Pokeant]] 10:04, 21 June 2011 (UTC)
:You are correct. I have already eliminated that statement since it is from the anime. You can add it in if you would like to. :] [[User:Han Ji-Wan|Han Ji-Wan]] 19:33, 21 June 2011 (UTC)

== Giratina returns to the Pokémon world prior to Generation I? ==

"Some years prior to Generation I: Giratina returns to the Pokémon world."
"Between Generation I/III and Generation II/IV: Giratina returns to the Distortion World."
Okay, where does it say that in the games or the like? --''Insert Witty Dialog Here'' [[User:NateVirus|NateVirus]]''([[User talk:NateVirus|Talk]])'' 01:38, 3 August 2011 (UTC)
:* I thought [[Giratina]] was stuck in Distortion World until the events in Platinum (or Generation IV really). But, I'll keep those parts up, in case there is a source that I'm missing. ----[[User:NateVirus|NateVirus]]''([[User talk:NateVirus|Talk]]''|''[[Special:Contributions/NateVirus|Contributions]]'') 06:02, 6 December 2011 (UTC)

== Parallel universe? ==

I've been toying with some ideas on an alternate view of the game's history based on a few key facts. Essentially, there must be some concrete level of parallelism between the real world and the Pokémon world, if everything in the games is taken as canon:

*Most (or many) Pokémon are classified by what type of animal they are (Pikachu is a "Mouse Pokémon", etc.), so it can be assumed that Pokémon were not prevalent as a whole in the universe until sometime within the realm of documented history; otherwise, animals would be classified by what Pokémon they are like (if there are even normal animals in the game; the only real indication I know of is the aquarium in the Cerulean City gym in the anime).
*From that point, two options emerge:
**Pokémon evolved from actual animals sometime approximately within the realm of documented history, then out-competed normal animals to near, if not total, extinction. This must have occurred within documented history, for surely even a minute population of a given species of Pokémon would quickly dominate any corresponding animal (e.g., two Pikachu could flourish against thousands of normal mice).
**Pokémon were suddenly introduced into the universe. This could have resulted from several things: Dialga/Palkia/Giratina essentially control all of space-time, so Pokémon could have been transferred from a totally different universe; a population of Mew that existed on the planet beyond human influence, because of some external influence, suddenly evolved into all manner of other Pokémon; or something to that effect.
*Taking the Pokédex entries as fact, refer to Golduck's entry from R/B, which makes mention of the "Japanese monster [[wp:Kappa_(folklore)|Kappa]]." This implies not only that Japan as a country exists in the Pokémon world, but also that its historical and cultural development must have been largely similar to its real-life history, or else such a legend would likely have never existed.
*Other entries of that sort appear, such as Poliwrath's, which refers to the Pacific Ocean, implying that general geography is such that sailing and exploration occurred in a similar way to real life. Also consider the journal entry claiming to have sighted Mew in Brazil (I believe?). As such, we can assume that the Pokémon world was for a long period of time identical to our own, save potentially for minor changes outside of human influence (e.g. Mew population), until some particularly disruptive event thrust the world into an alternate timeline.
*Of course, there must be some limitation as to how much parallelism is accepted as canon; every player character owns the latest generation of Nintendo console at home. What is to be made of that?
*Also consider the technological development of the world, especially based on needs and resources; teleportation is essentially perfected, but there are only a handful of planes, none of which are for passengers (as in Black/White).
*If these points are all accepted, we are given potential insight into the development of Pokémon society within species: Since Pokémon must have come to human attention after the development of language, it can be assumed that all Pokémon capable of saying their names evolved to do so only after sufficient exposure to humans calling them by that name, or else language would have been deterministic.
*Given that Pokémon did not dominate the ecosystem until relatively recently in the world's history, it is important to consider how Pokémon have or have not emigrated across continents. If humans have made contact across continents for some period of time, it should be expected that Pokémon would be able to do the same (e.g. if Pidgeot can fly at Mach 2, what's stopping it from crossing any ocean a boat or a Water-type Pokémon can cross and invading a new ecosystem?). This point requires more research.

I'd love to hear what you think!

[[User:FurretTurret|FurretTurret]] 04:05, 2 November 2011 (UTC)

== PokePark Wii ==
Can someone put the PokePark Wii plot in it? [[User:Metalfenix11|Metalfenix11]] 15:17, 16 December 2011 (UTC)

How do you guys know that PokePark Wii takes place between Generation I/III and II/IV??? [[User:Metalfenix11|Metalfenix11]] 12:29, 9 January 2012 (UTC)

== Implications of Steven being Champion and the Dotted Hole ==
What evidence is there that RSE are taking place at the same time as FrLG? The Dotted Hole saying "CONNECT THE PAST" in FrLG and Steven being Champion still in HgSs seem to being evidence that FrLG and RSE aren't taking place at the same time. Are there any events or dialog in RSE or FrLG that definitely (or probably) reference specific time-line events in the other? -[[User:Babilfrenzo|Babilfrenzo]] 19:32, 13 April 2012 (UTC)

== Evidence ==

Where's the evidence for Generations I and III taking place at the same time, and for Generations II and IV at the same time? Black and White show that Platinum is the canon version for the Sinnoh games, and it didn't have the Red Gyarados report. Trading without time travel is a flimsy justification at best. Cynthia never mentions the events of DPPt in HGSS, and Steven only makes vague reference to similar-looking challengers, not to the Aqua/Magma crisis. Is that different in the original Japanese? I forget exactly what the Hiker in Hearthome says about Elm's report on Eggs, can we see what he says in both language versions of Platinum? I was discussing this with a friend (trying to support the same time argument), but I was unable to find any hard evidence that he couldn't come up with an alternate explanation for, so this is all seeming like a lot of speculation being passed off as fact. --[[Gallade|'''エ''']][[User:Galladeon|'''ルレ''']][[User talk:Galladeon|'''イ''''''ド''']] 05:46, 15 April 2012 (UTC)

You're not kidding when you say 'Trading without time travel is a flimsy justification at best'. Colloseum and XD Take place five years apart, yet both of them can still trade with Generation III Games. The upcoming BW2 Games are also extremely likely to be able to trade with the original Black and White, although they take place two years apart. [[User:Pokelad2|Pokelad2]] 15:32, 15 April 2012 (UTC)

== Gen III concurrent with Gen V?!!?! ==

Caitlin is the same Caitlin in both Gen IV (Battle Frontier) and Gen V - she looks about 4 or 5 years older which would imply that 4-5 years pass between the ends of the two storylines. Now, there's a trainer in BW2 that mentions the Mirage Tower recently disappearing... does that mean Gen III is concurrent with Gen V?!
Based off that, I think it goes RGBYFRLG---3yrs---GSCHGSS---2yrs---DPPt---4yrs---BW---2yrs---BW2,RSE
[[User:Jjl2357|Jjl2357]] ([[User talk:Jjl2357|talk]]) 21:32, 10 March 2013 (UTC)jjl2357

In B2W2 there are Magma and Aqua grunts that have formed a family both say they were part of the teams in R/S/E "Several years ago". This means R/S/E happens several years before the events of B2W2 which can be anywhere between 3 to 11 years before B2W2 which puts it before Black and White's story anyway. Current placement is most accurate based on events that transpire between R/S/E, FR/LG, and the spin offs [[User:XanderO|XanderO]] ([[User talk:XanderO|talk]]) 02:47, 19 April 2013 (UTC)

== Timeline Citations ==

Forgive me, however after scanning through this article it bugs me that the only reasoning (which I can find) for Gen III and Gen I being concurrent is speculation and that doesn't sit well with me.

We know that Gen I and II are three years apart as that's mentioned repeatedly in G/S/C/HG/SS and B/W and B2/W2 are two years apart for the same reason.

We can derive that BW2 takes place after the events of RSE because of the Former Aqua/Magma couple in Iccarus, as we can derive it's after the events of Gen II and IV as Team Rocket and Galatic's failures are mention in N's castle in B/W.

Despite this, it doesn't nessessarily mean that D/P/Pt must be concurrent with G/S/C, likewise with R/S/E and R/B/Y, unless I've missed something?

As for Spin-Offs, admittedly the only one I've played is Ranger 2 and for all I know that could be before R/B/Y as it could be after BW2.

--

My point is, could we have it mentioned (maybe in the introduction) the order of the games as far as we cannoincally know?
[[User:Conductor Alix|Conductor Alix]] ([[User talk:Conductor Alix|talk]]) 00:16, 24 April 2013 (UTC)
: I was under the impression that RBY and RSE were considered concurrent because they reference the events of each other as current events, and the same goes for GSC and DPPt. DPPt had a mention of the Red Gyarados incident from GSC, for example. That being said, I can't remember what the other references were, so I might be completely wrong. [[User:Yamiidenryuu|Yamiidenryuu]] ([[User talk:Yamiidenryuu|talk]]) 22:35, 24 April 2013 (UTC)

== Some details ==

It somewhere information about the Giovanni/Silver/Celebi event in HGSS?
And about the later appearance of champions and gym leaders in B2W2, specially about Sabrina joining the Pokewood industry and Giovanni wasn't arrested or something?
DPPt storyline wasn't supposed to be a bit earlier than HGSS because of Jasmine appearance in Sunnyshore City and later change of clothes?
Sorry for my english :)
--[[User:Virus bass|Virus bass]] ([[User talk:Virus bass|talk]]) 17:52, 12 September 2013 (UTC)
==Old man in Coumarine City==

During my Pokemon Y playthrough i talked to this old man in Coumarine City. He said something about seeing a "Pokemon Trainer with a great Ampharos" in Azure Bay when he was a young boy (possibly Jasmine?). Is this helpful in placing X and Y in the timeline?
[[User:JEFLIV|JEFLIV]] ([[User talk:JEFLIV|talk]]) 03:56, 16 November 2013 (UTC)
:He probably talks about the man in Azure Bay who gives you an Ampharosite. And even if not, it would be speculation if it were Jasmine, and speculation on pages is not allowed. ☼ Blazing[[User talk:Blazingfist|Fist ☼]] 14:49, 16 November 2013 (UTC)

==Writer tweets timeline?==
The writer for the series has tweeted the official timeline for the series. Which mostly matches up with what you guys have here https://twitter.com/matsumiyan/status/464052839870787584 X and Y seem to take place at the same time as B/W2 --[[User:Tuskin38|Tuskin38]] ([[User talk:Tuskin38|talk]]) 15:42, 8 May 2014 (UTC)

== X/Y Can Not Be Concurrent With B/W2. X/Y Take Place During The Same Year As R/S/E ==

X/Y can't take place at the same time as B/W2 as the Y Pokedex entry for Lunatone states that it "..was discovered at the site of a meteor strike 40 years ago. " The pokedex entry for Emerald also states that it was found 40 years ago. Therefore X/Y have to take place at the same time as R/S/E.

[[User:Senkara|Senkara]] ([[User talk:Senkara|talk]]) 22:18, 11 May 2014 (UTC)
: The dex entries are already known to contain contradictory or outright nonsensical information, so I don't think keeping them coherent is much of a priority for Gamefreak. Most likely thay's just an oversight.
: Besides, it's confirmed that XY take place after BW at least (mentions of something big having gone down in Unova a couple years before the games), and BW take place after RS (don't remember which games, but there's the former Aqua and Magma couple). So XY being concurrent with RS is impossible anyway. [[User:Yamiidenryuu|Yamiidenryuu]] ([[User talk:Yamiidenryuu|talk]]) 22:45, 11 May 2014 (UTC)
::No, it was recently stated that XY and B2W2 take place around the same time. As for the Pokedex, it means nothing. They're full of things that don't really make sense. (Slugma as hot as the sun.) And it's just a reused entry anyway. [[User:Ataro|Ataro]] ([[User talk:Ataro|talk]]) 23:02, 11 May 2014 (UTC)

==Time Paradox Danger==
Well, I'm also excited for the upcoming games however there is a problem everyone ignores.
as RB(RG) comes with RSE, a remake for RB(RG) that takes time with RSE make sense indeed. and so on for remakes of GS and DPPt.
BUT, and here is a big but, RS already have a stated position in timeline, and if XY and RS will be able to trade with each other, we would yeild a time paradox.
The solutions that would remove this time paradox are as follows:
1. you will not be able to trade from XY to new RS, only through the bank.
2. it will be about 8-9 years after the events of the original RS, though if I'm not wrong it have been confrimed that aSoR would be remakes of RS with the same storyline and characters.
3. you will get an item or access to a place similar to GSC that will some sort of a time forward machine to be able to trade with XY.

if none of the above would happen, we will have a difficult to write the timeline properly.
sorry about my english, it's not my first language.
[[User:Shaked|Shaked]] ([[User talk:Shaked|talk]]) 15:16, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

== 3000 years prior... ==

In the actual article, there's a "3000 years before generation five" and a "3000 years before generation six". Whether or not the games happen at the same time (which B2/W2 do with X/Y) at the very most, there's only a decade separating the Kanto games from the Kalos games. So shouldn't both "3000 years" events be combined into one?--[[User:BlackButterfree|BlackButterfree]] ([[User talk:BlackButterfree|talk]]) 04:29, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

== Spin-off games ==

When have the spin-offs ever been considered canon? Colosseum/XD and the Ranger games are mentioned repeatedly in this article, despite not being developed by GameFREAK and never being referenced in any of the main games whatsoever. The officially released timeline doesn't even include them, so throwing them in here makes about as much sense as including Snap or the TCG Gameboy game. This is almost as bad as the "trio master" page for being almost entirely fan fiction.[[User:Five|Five]] ([[User talk:Five|talk]]) 09:12, 26 August 2014 (UTC)

== How ORAS fits into all of this ==

Now, as we all know, Zinna leaves a nice little quote during the Delta episode that implies a multiverse. And, as previously stated, ORAS would cause a time paradox if it were anywhere in the current timeline due to various elements such as Fairy types being just a normal thing while it was a big deal in XY, Mega Evolution being somewhat well known, etc.
This obviously points to the sheer implausibility of ORAS being anywhere in the main timeline. With Zinna's quote in context, could it be Nintendo cleaning up their continuity errors for once? All leads seem to point to it right now.--[[User:Hwrdjacob|Hwrdjacob]] ([[User talk:Hwrdjacob|talk]]) 05:51, 13 December 2014 (UTC)
:Zinnia's quote puts Omega Ruby and Alpha Sapphire firmly into the same timeline as X and Y. She mentions the ''other'' Hoenn belongs to a world where the Kalos War did not happen and Mega Evolutions aren't well known. ORAS fit into "all this" the same way all remakes do: they replace the older games in the main continuity. - [[User:Taylor|Taylor]] ([[User talk:Taylor|talk]]) 06:01, 13 December 2014 (UTC)
::About your points: breeding, Steel- and Dark-types were "a big deal" in the Johto games, and they're all treated as normal, common things in the original Hoenn games, which happen chronologically before. New features are only treated as such in their first appearance; in all following games, they're treated like they have always been there. This is not news. - [[User:Taylor|Taylor]] ([[User talk:Taylor|talk]]) 06:03, 13 December 2014 (UTC)
The difference being, however, that Gen 1 and 2 are very likely not the same timeline as Gen 3-6, with RS being something of a reboot in terms of continuity, and GS being firmly established as being after Emerald even before HGSS's release, making the whole Steel/Dark Type and Egg debate mostly moot. The other world she speaks of might very well be the verse of Gen 3, which if ORAS is concurrent with Emerald, would make sense at the time. Compounding these facts is that ORAS would create contradictions, regardless if you placed it around the time of FRLG or the time of XY. In addition, while every feature of the original Gen 1 and 2 were retained, with additions and extensions while towns were mostly kept the same with the exception of minor updates, Mauvile is just one example of an absolutely blatent example of intentional differentiation from the originals, along with axing the Battle Tower/Frontier for no good reason. Also, every major character is redesigned, it seems, something neither of the other two remakes did, with the arguable exception of the main characters. And this is of course, ignoring the contradictions in Mega Evolution backstory- Lucario VS. Rayquaza being first to Mega Evolve and Rayquaza making Mega Evolution vs. Xerneas/Yveltal making it via the Ultimate Weapon's radiation (The latter of which I am admittedly fuzzy on the side of Rayquaza's version). I could go on, with details such as the changing of most of the Gyms, Cosplay Pikachu, etc. Generally the reason new features are treated like they always were there I believe is because there isn't usually any of major significance, outside of adding Steel/Dark and Breeding, which a reboot fixed pretty quickly since technically, it was then correct to say it was always there... --[[User:Hwrdjacob|Hwrdjacob]] ([[User talk:Hwrdjacob|talk]]) 06:36, 13 December 2014 (UTC)
:Emerald hasn't been canon since HeartGold and SoulSilver, and now Ruby and Sapphire are no longer canon either. I could go on about your points and speculations (the other remakes ''didn't'' have redesigns, really?), but in fact it's as simple as that. - [[User:Taylor|Taylor]] ([[User talk:Taylor|talk]]) 06:43, 13 December 2014 (UTC)
::There is an interesting claim that you just made. Would you explain why the release of HeartGold and SoulSilver made Emerald no longer canon? --[[User:Super goku|Super goku]] ([[User talk:Super goku|talk]]) 06:50, 13 December 2014 (UTC)
:::HeartGold and SoulSilver, which take place after the Hoenn events, state that ''Steven'' is the Hoenn Champion. In Emerald canon, Wallace is the titleholder. - [[User:Taylor|Taylor]] ([[User talk:Taylor|talk]]) 07:04, 13 December 2014 (UTC)
::Keep in mind, we don't know what happens between generations. Wallace being Champion was implied in Emerald to be a VERY recent development, possibly even happening after you began your journey. So keep in mind, even with Emerald canon, he could have reclaimed his title behind the scenes. After all, Red relinquished his behind the scenes. If anything, I think it cements Emerald as canon by referencing both Aqua and Magma in a negative light. --[[User:Hwrdjacob|Hwrdjacob]] ([[User talk:Hwrdjacob|talk]]) 13:14, 13 December 2014 (UTC)
::Apparently, Championship is a very fragile thing, futher shown by Iris and Alder...--[[User:Hwrdjacob|Hwrdjacob]] ([[User talk:Hwrdjacob|talk]]) 13:18, 13 December 2014 (UTC)
::As for the redesign thing, I'm aware there were minor tweaks in most cases, but only once or twice did they take very durastic liberties, and it was only with Blue in HGSS and arguably the player characters off the top of my head. Try comparing pretty much any Gym Leader in ORAS to RSE...--[[User:Hwrdjacob|Hwrdjacob]] ([[User talk:Hwrdjacob|talk]]) 13:29, 13 December 2014 (UTC)
::And ultimately, Steven only remains Champion at the end in RS. He relinquishes his title to Wallace during the Delta episode.--[[User:Hwrdjacob|Hwrdjacob]] ([[User talk:Hwrdjacob|talk]]) 14:48, 13 December 2014 (UTC)
::The PWT in BW2 makes Emerald being canon even more likely. Blue is counted in the Champion Cup, implying they count current AND former Champions. Not only does Wallace appear, but he does so in the Champion Cup and using his Emerald appearance. It seems as if he became Champion in Emerald, then lost the title again to Steven, if he says he is Champion in HGSS on. [[User:Hwrdjacob|Hwrdjacob]] ([[User talk:Hwrdjacob|talk]]) 17:20, 13 December 2014 (UTC)
:::Speculation, speculation. The solid fact is that HGSS take place after the Hoenn games and Steven is the Champion - like RSORAS, unlike Emerald. (And have you really paid attention to ORAS? Steven doesn't relinquish his title, he suggests he ''may'' do something like that ''one day''; ''both'' Magma and Aqua are villains in both games, the only difference is which of them is the bigger threat and which reforms first). And, please, don't say there were never radical redesigns in the past, you're insulting everyone's intelligence (Blaine, Karen, the Rocket Executives, there are countless examples). Moreover, PWT is purely fan service and its canonicity is questionable; seriously, it has ''Giovanni'' waltzing around the place. Bottom line: as far as we know, remakes work now the same way they '''''always''''' did. You're desperately trying to find excuses to assume that Game Freak will for some reason change the way things have always been done and somehow deem that a ten year-old game is canon and the newest releases -- telling the same story -- are non-canon. - [[User:Taylor|Taylor]] ([[User talk:Taylor|talk]]) 20:52, 13 December 2014 (UTC)
::Giovanni was allowed to be Gym Leader in the first place, y'know, so I doubt anyone would bat an eye at him if he waltzed into the PWT. And since Driftveil was renovated for the purpose of hosting it, and the events with Colress there, I think it's canonical status is spoken for. Plus, the Rocket Execs? If you're referring to Proton and Petrel, the design was still used by Archer, so... there.And I'm not denying there weren't ANY radical redesigns, but they at least attempted to keep the same appearance with the majority of the characters. A good portion of THE ENTIRE CAST is radically altered and there's a blatent sense they aren't intended to look anyting like the originals (Contrast Emerald Brawly with ORAS Brawly, then GSC Brock with HGSS Brock for my point...) Lastly, I find it a bit hypocritical you'd put "No Speculation" on an article that has pretty much no basis for the placement of Pokemon XD. Im am not implying ORAS is non canon either. That's pure speculation on your part.--[[User:Hwrdjacob|Hwrdjacob]] ([[User talk:Hwrdjacob|talk]]) 22:25, 13 December 2014 (UTC)

== Separate Timeline? ==

I think Gen VI is set in a separate timeline since Mega Evolution is in the games and isn't in the games prior to them. Also Zinnia states about another Hoenn where Mega Evolution is unknown, which could be the one from RSE. [[User:Ellis99|Ellis99]] ([[User talk:Ellis99|talk]]) 12:54, 10 January 2015 (UTC)

It was confirmed a while ago that the events of X and Y are contemporaneous with the events of BW2 in terms of the timeline of all games as a whole (in other words, BW2 and XY happen at the same time). Plus, it isn't confirmed that the original RSE timeline is the exact alternate Hoenn that Zinnia refers to in the Delta Episode. Plus, I think you took that wrong, even if X and Y are in a different universe, I don't think it is exactly a ''separate timeline'', per se, but rather an alternate universe with a very similar timeline, but with the presence of Mega Evolution and the war. Furthermore, I strongly doubt this would matter much, as this page is already filled to the brim with discrepancy anyways, and Pokemon history is already very unstable and confusing... [[User:ScraftyIsTheBest|ScraftyIsTheBest]] ([[User talk:ScraftyIsTheBest|talk]]) 14:43, 10 January 2015 (UTC)

Talk:Zinnia

2015-03-18T06:01:23Z

MofoMan2000: /* Parallel Hoenn */

==Aster's namesake==

In the climax of the Delta Episode, right before Rayquaza is summoned, Zinnia describes how Aster is named after someone dear to her who passed away. In the Magma/Aqua Hideout she describes Aster (the Whismur) as her "daughter", and the revelation at Sky Pillar makes it slightly unclear whether, when she speaks to Aster at various points in the game, she's addressing the actual Pokémon or Aster's namesake.

I don't want to add anything too speculative since the scene is extremely ambiguous, but I do think that some of the explicit facts about Aster (namely, that she's named after a deceased character) deserve to be mentioned on the page outside of the quotes themselves. Arguably Aster might even deserve a section on the page, the same way [AZ]'s Floette does. —[[User:AndyPKMN|AndyPKMN]] [[User talk:AndyPKMN|(talk)]] 01:41, 13 December 2014 (UTC)

:i think it should be a trivia thing; considering that Zinnia said that she 'lost her' it's evident that she's speaking of Aster's namesake since Aster is directly next to her. My suggestion is a sister or daughter, but to remove speculation it's simpler to point out in trivia something along the lines of 'Although Aster is almost always beside her, Zinnia sometimes speaks about having lost Aster, suggesting that she may have named the Whismur after someone close to her who died prior to the events of the Game.' So it's based more factually than theoretically. All in all, i do agree that it is something noteworthy [[User:Azure42|Azure/ChromeVoid42]] ([[User talk:Azure42|talk]]) 20:08, 12 January 2015 (UTC)

== B/W reference ==

In Granite Cave, she mentions truths and ideals- is this a reference to Reshiram & Zekrom? It seems so, but publishing speculation is not acceptable. Would it be appropriate to link the B/W articles there, or am I making references in my head?
[[User:Partone|Partone]] ([[User talk:Partone|talk]]) 08:54, 22 December 2014 (UTC)Partone

This certainly is a direct reference to B/W, actually. [[User:-AuraGuardian-|-AuraGuardian-]] ([[User talk:-AuraGuardian-|talk]]) 06:34, 2 January 2015 (UTC)

== Zinnia's Grandmother ==

Can we get a page on this ASAP? She does play a pretty heavy part in the Delta episode, by giving vital information, and she's related to the last Lorekeeper, Zinnia, while also happening to be both a Move Tutor and the only and last tutor to re-teach Rayquaza Dragon Ascent, which is pretty important, as it's needed for Ray to ME. Additionally, she is one of the remaining Draconids, so she needs a page. (Was looking for certain quotes said in-game for the DE that only come from this character, so when I couldn't find it, I was disappointed.) [[User:-AuraGuardian-|-AuraGuardian-]] ([[User talk:-AuraGuardian-|talk]]) 06:32, 2 January 2015 (UTC)

== Parallel Hoenn ==

I find it strange that something Zinnia mentioned as profound as "A Hoenn region that's almost exactly like this one we live in" is never really explored in the article. The only time it is mentioned is in the direct quote from her. It's a very strange thing for her to bring up, and has some far-reaching implications. As is linked in the article, it may indeed be a reference to the original Ruby and Sapphire versions, and in this case it is the first time (as far as I know) that a character seems aware of the remake versions being distinct in some way from the originals. It would also imply that OR/AS aren't meant to be simply remakes of R/S, but also that they take place in a parallel but equally valid universe. This raises questions of not only when the games take place relative to each others' timelines, but in what universe? What is different about the Kalos region in the old universe, if the great war never happened, and the ultimate weapon never constructed? Does this not deserve further investigation? Though, I'm afraid all we can do right now is speculate. [[User:MofoMan2000|MofoMan2000]] ([[User talk:MofoMan2000|talk]]) 05:40, 18 March 2015 (UTC)

I guess there are some blurbs about it in other articles, but usually only a short sentence. I'm more concerned with this article as it is now. [[User:MofoMan2000|MofoMan2000]] ([[User talk:MofoMan2000|talk]]) 06:01, 18 March 2015 (UTC)

Talk:Zinnia

2015-03-18T05:40:48Z

MofoMan2000: /* Parallel Hoenn */ new section

Talk:Hoopa (Pokémon)

2015-03-18T01:43:33Z

MofoMan2000: /* Game locations */ new section

==ORAS entries==
I think they've actually changed (unless Formes have separate entries :P), since [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YPcLdq7Ilk8&list=UU0A_Jk_KqFcwnEBtyNqolsA this]. Probably because of the new Forme. [[User:Eridanus|Eridanus]] ([[User talk:Eridanus|talk]]) 12:54, 13 December 2014 (UTC)
:I have already updated it. thanks for the help in editing!:)[[User:Phiraptor28|Phiraptor28]] ([[User talk:Phiraptor28|talk]]) 10:26, 15 December 2014 (UTC)

== Hoopa Confined's Description ==

You must have been looking at the old art (http://www.deviantart.com/art/Hoopa-410943259) that influenced a lot of people before we could actually get a clear shot of Hoopa. This is a more accurate look at it (http://www.deviantart.com/art/Hoopa-v-2-477350821). Of note, it doesn't have claws on its hands; they're more like mittens. [[User:Alxprit|Alxprit]] ([[User talk:Alxprit|talk]]) 21:08, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

== Japanese Name ==

Hoopa's name in Japanese is フーパ (''Fūpa''), though you probably know this already. [[User:LittleOmu|LittleOmu]] ([[User talk:LittleOmu|talk]]) 05:58, 5 January 2015 (UTC)
:See [[User_talk:Phiraptor28/Hoopa (Pokémon)#In other_languages|here]] on the user page. The Japanese is already there, though the ''Fūpa'' part is not. I will leave that to someone else to determine adding, though I believe it can be. [[User:CycloneGU|CycloneGU]] ([[User talk:CycloneGU|talk]]) 06:45, 5 January 2015 (UTC)
::Fūpa is a transliteration of the katakana. The katakana is a transliteration of Hoopa. Therefore, the Japanese name is Hoopa. [[User:Pikachu Bros.|Pikachu Bros.]] ([[User talk:Pikachu Bros.|talk]]) 18:34, 5 January 2015 (UTC)
:::That's not what I meant... On the right side of the page, where the template for the Pokémon information is located, the kana reads シェイミ (''Sheimi'') instead of フーパ (''Fūpa''). [[User:LittleOmu|LittleOmu]] ([[User talk:LittleOmu|talk]]) 07:15, 9 January 2015 (UTC)
::::I'm sorry guys 'coz I copied Shaymin's template to create this page... I'll edit it right away. Thanks to all! [[User:Phiraptor28|Phiraptor28]] ([[User talk:Phiraptor28|talk]]) 13:42, 9 January 2015 (UTC)

== Prev/Next Bar ==

Guys, please don't change Bulbasaur into Volcanion. Hoopa is going to be released maybe in the next two months, for he's involved in teleporting the [[Weather trio]] to [[Kalos]]. Volcanion will not be released '''simultaneously''' with Hoopa. When Bulbapedia puts this page into the mainspace, Volcanion still won't be in "official" existence. This would yet always end up like this. Even though we know Volcanion exists, he is yet to be acknowledged by Nintendo. So:

{{PokémonPrevNextHead | species=Hoopa | prev=Diancie | next=Bulbasaur | prevnum=719 | nextnum=001 | type=psychic | type2={{#switch: {{#expr: {{#time: i}} mod 2}}|0=Ghost|1=Dark}}}}

But then, as you see in my [[User:Phiraptor28/Volcanion_(Pokémon)|Volcanion page]], this would be the only instance that Hoopa and Bulbasaur's pages would be linked together. If Hoopa is revealed, the PrevNext Bar would be 719 - '''720''' - 001. If Volcanion is revealed, it would be 720 - '''721''' - 001. In layman's term, '''DO NOT EDIT THE PREVNEXT BAR TO SOON'''. I hope you bear with me. :) [[User:Phiraptor28|Phiraptor28]] ([[User talk:Phiraptor28|talk]]) 13:53, 9 January 2015 (UTC)

== Hiding Unbound information ==

As I'm sure this article will be mainspaced soon, I'm wondering whether or not the Unbound information should be hidden? Seeming Volcanion (and Hoopa until now) don't have mainspaced pages because of their unofficially revealed status, that the Unbound information should be omitted because its basically in the same boat as Volcanion. I'm absolutely certain the Unbound forme will be officially revealed before July, but still, the fact remains until then it's not officially released information until then. --[[User:S2daam|--samm :D]] 15:10, 10 January 2015 (UTC)

I agree with this because a lot of Diancie's information was also hidden last year until more information was officially announced and it eventually became obtainable in an official event. [[User:Water Max|Water Max]] ([[User talk:Water Max|talk]]) 13:19, 11 January 2015 (UTC)

:I agree as well. Hoopa's unbound form has not been officially revealed by Nintendo yet (to my knowledge), so I don't think we should have it on this page. [[User:ShermTank7272|ShermTank7272]] ([[User talk:ShermTank7272|talk]]) 18:50, 23 January 2015 (UTC)

== Forme names ==

Is it "Hoopa Confined" and "Hoopa Unbound", or "Confined Forme" and "Unbound Forme"? This article uses them interchangeably, which is incorrect. --[[User:SnorlaxMonster|'''Snorlax''']][[User talk:SnorlaxMonster|'''Monster''']] 15:16, 10 January 2015 (UTC)
:I'm not sure if it'll help, but in the ORAS text dump, the file that has things like "Altered Forme", "Overcast Form", and "Mega Diancie" also has "Hoopa Confined" and "Hoopa Unbound" (in that relative order). [[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 15:26, 10 January 2015 (UTC)
:::It is really '''Hoopa Confined''' or '''Hoopa Unbound'''. As you see, I already put the forme names in the head section of the page, even at the first time I created this. The problem that ''Confined Forme'' and ''Unbound Forme'' came to existence is because when I was creating the infobox (and the evolution section), I learned that the coding of Bulbapedia's Infobox does not recognize the proper order of the names of Hoopa's forme differences; which is because of the previous Pokémon with forme differences, but '''the''' '''''"forme"''''' ''in their formes go'' '''''after''''' '''their forme name.''' Examples are such as ''Sky Forme Shaymin''. Otherwise it would be ''Shaymin Sky'', if we follow Hoopa's format. [[User:Phiraptor28|Phiraptor28]] ([[User talk:Phiraptor28|talk]]) 06:49, 11 January 2015 (UTC)
::::That's a false equivalence. Just because Hoopa is done this way does not at all mean Shaymin or anything else is "wrong" or contradicted. (Until I can have Hoopa in my own game or see some official (English) usage, I can't offer a real opinion on whether the current way is right or wrong, but I would hazard that it's right.) [[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 07:02, 11 January 2015 (UTC)

== The Djinn Pokemon ==

If you read the OR/AS PokeDex Entries with Hoopa Confined as the Forme shown, it displays "Mischief" as it did in X/Y. However, if Unbound is selected when viewing this page, it's called "Djinn" instead. Does any other Pokemon with a Forme Change ever change their [[Species]] name whenever viewed differently in the PokeDex as such? [[User:Shiramu Kuromu|Shiramu Kuromu]] ([[User talk:Shiramu Kuromu|talk]]) 13:24, 11 January 2015 (UTC)

:As far as I can tell, no. Also considering that Hoopa is the only Generation VI Pokémon with unique Pokédex entries in ORAS whereas every other Gen VI Pokemon just reuses theirs from X/Y. [[User:Superjustinbros.|Superjustinbros.]] ([[User talk:Superjustinbros.|talk]]) 21:05, 11 January 2015 (UTC)

== Is Hoopa The New Pixie? ==

Y'know, the small, cute, "fairy"-looking legendary with 600 BST like Mew, Celebi, Jirachi, Manaphy, Shaymin and Victini (I consider Uxie, Azelf and Mesprit honorary Pixies because they look a lot like pale Mew with helmets, and they have similar sizes to the rest of the pixies, but they don't have 600 BST's)?
Hoopa would also be the first Pixie Legendary to not have an equal 100/100/100/100/100/100 spread, and the second to have an item-linked Forme change after Shaymin (who has both Land and Sky).
And the first to have slight involvement in a game's storyline since Mew (both are directly alluded to in their respective games. Mew with the Pokémon Mansion journals, and Hoopa with the Mirage Spots).--[[User:BlackButterfree|BlackButterfree]] ([[User talk:BlackButterfree|talk]]) 00:13, 12 January 2015 (UTC)
:"Small" is subjective, "cute" and "'fairy'-looking" are opinionated, and "600 BST" is a trait shared by a TON of Mythical Pokémon beyond just those six, meaning that the only ''factual'' relation between specifically them is that they are all Mythical and have straight-100 stats. Hoopa is Mythical, but since it doesn't meet the ''only'' other criterium, it doesn't qualify, so rather than being considered "the only Pixie not to have straight-100 stats," I would just not call it a Pixie. Please remember that this has to all be fact-based, so we can't just categorize Pokémon based on similar appearances - if Hoopa counted as a pixie despite not having straight-100 stats, then wouldn't Diancie and even Darkrai also have to? They also have BSTs of 600 and are Mythical; they, ''like Hoopa,'' lack the straight-100 stats, but if Hoopa counts, there's no reason for them not to count. I don't think Hoopa can be grouped with the Pixies - we ''didn't'' count Diancie and Darkrai, did we? [[User:EpicDeino|EpicDeino]] ([[User talk:EpicDeino|talk]]) 11:45, 12 January 2015 (UTC)
::Subject? Likely. Either way, [[Appendix:Fan terminology#Cute Legendary Pokémon|we have a definition on the Appendix]]. (Though, they are not called Pixies.) --[[User:Super goku|Super goku]] ([[User talk:Super goku|talk]]) 21:54, 12 January 2015 (UTC)
:::So is that a yes or a no? Hoopa seems to fit the entire definition in the Appendix aside from the 100 stat spread. --[[User:BlackButterfree|BlackButterfree]] ([[User talk:BlackButterfree|talk]]) 09:09, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
::::It doesn't meet the definition (as you said yourself), so it isn't. --[[User:SnorlaxMonster|'''Snorlax''']][[User talk:SnorlaxMonster|'''Monster''']] 09:19, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

== Pokemon Infobox problem ==

Hoopa's forms don't work entirely right in the Pokemon infobox. Under the images, it says "Confined/Unbound Hoopa" instead of "Hoopa Confined/Unbound". This should be corrected somehow. (If I had to make a suggestion, my first would be to just create a special template. ...Which might also be useful for the handling the dual species names.) [[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 19:53, 12 January 2015 (UTC)
:I'm not sure I understand the problem. The same template used there, I think, is used for all Megas (see {{p|Altaria}} for instance). Once we have proper art for both forms and more than a magazine clipping, it'll make a lot more sense, I think. Right now, the text replaces an image that does not exist. [[User:CycloneGU|CycloneGU]] ([[User talk:CycloneGU|talk]]) 19:58, 12 January 2015 (UTC)
::All right, based on your edit, I see what you mean now. I'm curious which one the game uses, as that's the one that we should prioritize to. [[User:CycloneGU|CycloneGU]] ([[User talk:CycloneGU|talk]]) 20:09, 12 January 2015 (UTC)
:::...Do you? (See what I "mean".) Are you talking about species names (which is the thing I just edited), or form names? The species names are a complete tangent here. The form names are the real issue here, and are wrong as shown under the images (and this will not change when proper images are in place, or make any new "sense"; "Confined/Unbound Hoopa" is simply ''wrong''). [[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 20:19, 12 January 2015 (UTC)
::::Um, yes. I "do". =P
::::What I mean, though, is what will the Pokédex use? When you receive it, it goes in the Pokédex, then you look at it, and it says either "The Mischief Pokémon" or "The Djinn Pokémon". Whichever one the Pokédex uses takes priority, though I'm not against prose that the other term is also used (I think we want to go away from tooltips for mobile users). [[User:CycloneGU|CycloneGU]] ([[User talk:CycloneGU|talk]]) 20:35, 12 January 2015 (UTC)
:::::I think the species names should pretty much stay entirely in the infobox. Even if the infobox never changes. I mean, the only way I can think of explaining it in prose just comes off as trivia. Ideally, though, the infobox should differentiate them better than the current solution. [[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 20:42, 12 January 2015 (UTC)
::::::It could be set up like the game locations box and allow for the variable "species2" or something like that. When it's defined as anything, a line break is added followed by the text presented in "species2". [[User:CycloneGU|CycloneGU]] ([[User talk:CycloneGU|talk]]) 21:01, 12 January 2015 (UTC)

== Possible name inspiration ==

In addition to the obvious "Hoop" part of its name, I think Hoopa could also be referencing OOPArts, or "out-of-place artifacts". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Out-of-place_artifact
It certainly fits with its theme of teleporting objects to seemingly random locations. [[User:Silverlucario|Frezgle (Silverlucario)]] ([[User talk:Silverlucario|talk]]) 03:32, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

:Hmm, seems like it [[User:Animaltamer7|Animaltamer7]]06:42, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
::No, I really don't think "''an object [...] found in a very unusual or seemingly impossible context that could challenge conventional historical chronology by being "too advanced" for the level of civilization that existed at the time, or showing "human presence" well before humans were supposed to exist''" is at all related to Hoopa. Just because Hoopa ''could'' be the cause does not at all mean it's reasonable. Until such a case is actually mentioned, you're theorizing on the consequences of Hoopa's habits much too far without real subtantiation (i.e., it's just a huge guess). [[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 07:05, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

== Artwork ==

This is the official Hoopa's artwork: http://archives.bulbagarden.net/wiki/File:720Hoopa.png
Please include this. {{unsigned|RickFreak}}
:It's already there. Purge your cache. --[[User:Abcboy|Abcboy]] ([[User talk:Abcboy|talk]]) 23:38, 19 January 2015 (UTC)
::It's not actually a user-side issue. Either the image will update in about a month, or a high enough staff member may decide to purge the cached image sooner. [[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 23:44, 19 January 2015 (UTC)
:::No, it's already been updated on the server-side. After I cleared my cache, the correct artwork was there. --[[User:Abcboy|Abcboy]] ([[User talk:Abcboy|talk]]) 00:25, 20 January 2015 (UTC)
::::On this page? I've done everything I know to update this [[Hoopa (Pokémon)]], and I still see the magazine scan. (Which is as I expect; it's your experience I can't account for.) [[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 00:37, 20 January 2015 (UTC)
:::::And it's already February and the magazine scan is still used over the artwork... [[User:Superjustinbros.|Superjustinbros.]] ([[User talk:Superjustinbros.|talk]]) 21:10, 5 February 2015 (UTC)
::::::I did say it should update in "about a month", but I really meant "to my knowledge, exactly a month". Expect it to be right next weekend. If that weekend passes and it's not up to date...wait ''another'' few days, just for "safety". Then complain. [[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 21:33, 5 February 2015 (UTC)
:::::::You need to manually purge the page. Visit the Hoopa article page, then add to the URL ?action=purge, then on your keyboard do a forced reset by pressing Ctrl+F5 if you have a Windows machine. If it doesn't work, then you'll need to clear your internet cache completely or just wait.[[User:DarienLeonhart|DarienLeonhart]] ([[User talk:DarienLeonhart|talk]]) 21:42, 5 February 2015 (UTC)
::::::::Let me ask you: do you see Hoopa's artwork? (That is, [http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/f/fb/720Hoopa.png this] instead of [http://archives.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/archive/f/fb/20150114155939!720Hoopa.png this].) And if not, have you tried this advice you're offering? I have (just now in fact, just to be sure), and, as I said above, it hasn't helped. To my knowledge, this is not solvable user-side. [[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 21:48, 5 February 2015 (UTC)
:::::::::I just tried purging and it made no difference. Bulba-side problem. [[User:Me, Hurray!|Me, Hurray!]] ([[User talk:Me, Hurray!|talk]]) 23:17, 5 February 2015 (UTC)

== Time travel description ==

This little sentence makes it seem as if the author was the time traveller:
'''It was officially revealed in the February 2015 issue of CoroCoro magazine on January 10, 2015.'''
Either the date is wrong, or it should be changed to either:
'''It will be officially revealed in the February 2015 issue of CoroCoro magazine.'''(as mentioning the date twice makes it sound weird)
or
'''It was officially revealed in the leaked February 2015 issue of CoroCoro magazine.'''
Someone who knows the actual situation should edit this. --[[User:Markoatonc|Markoatonc]] ([[User talk:Markoatonc|talk]]) 17:46, 23 January 2015 (UTC)
:That's how magazines operate. Monthly magazines often say the issue is for the next month to keep sales of it up. [[User:Glik|glik]][[User talk:Glik|glak]] 18:04, 23 January 2015 (UTC)
::This Won't change that the form of this sentence is wrong. It was revealed in January issue that the February issue will have info about it.
::I suggest: '''It was announced in the CoroCoro magazine on January 10, 2015 that the pokemon will be officially introduced in February 2015 issue of the magazine.''' OK, I suggest that someone with the right permissions should change it. {{unsigned|Markoatonc}}
:::They're saying that the February issue was released in January. Again, many companies do this. [[User:Starscream|Starscream]] ([[User talk:Starscream|talk]]) 19:55, 23 January 2015 (UTC)
::::OK... I get it now. But no Magazine company I know does that, at least not like this. Still, thanks for clearing that up. {{unsigned|Markoatonc}}
:::::If you need more information on publications following this release format (date of edition not matching the month/week it's released), try {{wp|cover date}}s. [[User:ArcToraphim|Kai]] * the [[User talk:ArcToraphim|Arc]] [[Special:Contributions/ArcToraphim|Toraph]] 14:10, 24 January 2015 (UTC)

== Confined Hoopa is only a head? ==

Confined Hoopa seemed to have "hands". Is this true that Confined Hoopa has no arms and legs?
--[[User:HoennLove200|HoennLove200]] ([[User talk:HoennLove200|talk]]) 08:15, 2 February 2015 (UTC)
:What do you mean by "seemed"? Has it (the confined form) changed? [[User:Partone|Partone]] ([[User talk:Partone|talk]]) 12:45, 2 February 2015 (UTC)
::Hoopa Confined hasn't changed. If you look at Hoopa's artwork, it definitely has hands, although it does not have legs. [[User:Litwick96|Litwick96]] ([[User talk:Litwick96|talk]]) 22:32, 5 February 2015 (UTC)
:::Look at the body shape... --[[User:HoennLove200|HoennLove200]] ([[User talk:HoennLove200|talk]]) 22:39, 5 February 2015 (UTC)
::::That's just the body style from the Pokédex, it doesn't really mean much. A lot of things with that body style have more than just heads, for example {{p|Mismagius}}. {{unsigned|Litwick96}}

== Mirage spots ==

Was it ever 100% confirmed that the mysterious portals scattered around [[Hoenn]] (e.g. {{p|Lugia}}/{{p|Ho-Oh}} at [[Sea Mauville]]) were the work of a Hoopa? - [[User:Chosen|Chosen]] of [[User talk:Chosen|Mana]] 15:11, 25 February 2015 (UTC)
:I don't know it was ever suggested... [[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 15:16, 25 February 2015 (UTC)
::I haven't heard of anything official that says Hoopa is responsible for the portals, but they are identical to portals that appear in the animation for Hyperspace Fury. In addition, although this may be more speculative, I believe [[M18|the next movie]] has been confirmed to involve Hoopa using rings to transport things around [[User:Litwick96|Litwick96]] ([[User talk:Litwick96|talk]]) 15:29, 25 February 2015 (UTC)
:::They're giant rings that spit out Pokemon from other regions. It's Hoopa's handiwork. It's heavily implied, but not explicitly confirmed. [[User:Ataro|Ataro]] ([[User talk:Ataro|talk]]) 01:28, 26 February 2015 (UTC)

== Game locations ==

Hoopa's location is listed as "Event" for OR/AS, but the "In Events" section is completely empty. Going to the [[Event Pokémon]] article contains no information on Hoopa at all. This doesn't seem very appropriate right now given that clearly Hoopa's event hasn't happened yet, and no information seems to exist about it anywhere. [[User:MofoMan2000|MofoMan2000]] ([[User talk:MofoMan2000|talk]]) 01:43, 18 March 2015 (UTC)