Talk:Z-Move

2018-09-03T00:24:00Z

B ron 3000:

==Dutch name==
Could someone add the Dutch name Z-aanvalle? --[[User:Raltseye|Raltseye]] [[User talk:Raltseye|prata med mej]] 14:12, 16 September 2016 (UTC)

== Pikachu and Eevee's Z-Moves ==

Today, they revealed that Pikachu and Eevee are getting their own Z-Moves. Can someone who is able to edit this page update it so it includes Pikachu's Catastropika and Eevee's Extreme Evoboost? --[[User:PKMNAdventurer|PKMNAdventurer]] ([[User talk:PKMNAdventurer|talk]]) 21:03, 20 September 2016 (UTC)

== Edit request ==

Could someone add <code><nowiki>[[Category:Z-Moves|*]]</nowiki></code>, please? (Or unprotect this?) [[User:Nescientist|Nescientist]] ([[User talk:Nescientist|talk]]) 07:49, 29 September 2016 (UTC)

== Swedish name ==

Could someone add the Swedish name Z-attack? [https://indd.adobe.com/view/56287b29-1c87-4592-a65a-b1704c4d160d source] --[[User:Raltseye|Raltseye]] [[User talk:Raltseye|prata med mej]] 10:14, 6 October 2016 (UTC)

EDIT: Also, could the same person add the Finnish name Z-liike? [https://indd.adobe.com/view/3251cb4e-76d7-41d4-b71d-17ccdf52b4f2 source] --[[User:Raltseye|Raltseye]] [[User talk:Raltseye|prata med mej]] 10:49, 6 October 2016 (UTC)
:Also the czech name is in plural the singular form is útok. --[[User:Raltseye|Raltseye]] [[User talk:Raltseye|prata med mej]] 13:00, 21 October 2016 (UTC)
::Also the Hungarian name is in plural the singular form would be mozdulat. --[[User:Raltseye|Raltseye]] [[User talk:Raltseye|prata med mej]] 12:33, 22 October 2016 (UTC)

== Improvement suggestions ==

..or at least some food for thought I'd like to share:
* Terminology: (Z-)Crystals "upgrade" Z-Moves ({{DL|Z-Crystal|Electrium Z|1}}), Giga Impact "transforms" to Pulv. Pancake ([http://www.pokemon-sunmoon.com/en-us/exclusive-z-moves/ 2]), which is its "[Pokémon-]exclusive Z-Move" (2); the upgraded move is the "original move" ({{DL|Gigavolt Havoc (move)|Description|3}}). I'm not 100% sure, but I think I have not seen "<move> powers up [to <Z-Move>]", or "base move", "required move", or "signature Z-Move".
* Type Z-Crystal mechanic: we can apparently equip a held item to a Pokémon directly by "Use"-ing the Bag item, without removing any item from the Bag; this probably means that there will have to be a new mechanic for removing the held item from Pokémon without adding anything to the Bag (but we do not currently know that).
* Snorlium etc.: We/I know next to nothing about those. Technically, I guess we don't even no their Bag section, or whether they can be in the Bag at all (again, technically). But we do know that the Munchlax will hold a Snorlium Z ([http://www.pokemon-sunmoon.com/en-us/pulverizing-snorlax/ 4]), so obviously a held item. (Given that there's no indication they'll distribute Bag Snorliums or have an in-game event, I think it's actually quite possible that those work different than the type Crystals, but more than Mega Stones — you may be able just to "Give"/"Take" them like regular held items; the wording's ambiguous, the corresponding Z-Ring item might then just be Normalium etc.)
* Z-Power: It might only be an ideological justification to only use Z-Moves once per game, and the name of the button in the battle screen. There may be more to it, though.
* Category/damage-dealing: We/I know Z-Moves are "powerful"/"of great power" (1, 2, 3), not necassarily physical or special, or damage-dealing. (I think it's actually quite possible Evoboost is a status move.)
** We/I don't know whether status moves can be upgraded/transformed to (type) Z-Moves. Maybe it's not possible ([http://www.pokemon-sunmoon.com/en-us/z-moves/ 4] says it's "''a'' move of the same type", not "''any'' move"); but I think it's still ''possible'' they'll all be physical Z-Moves with 80 power or something like that.
** (I think it's possible that the Z-Move's power depends on the original move's power, not the original move itself. It could be done by formula or lookup table, but it needn't.)
* Things one can maybe test, but maybe not in the Demo (due to weak Plumeria): Does using a Z-Move deplete the original move's PP? Can you use the Z-Move when the original move has run out of PP? (Is the current PP carried over at all, or just the max PP?) [[User:Nescientist|Nescientist]] ([[User talk:Nescientist|talk]]) 19:01, 25 October 2016 (UTC)
:'''Terms''': Some of these are descriptions and you don't ''have'' to parrot all descriptions '''''exactly'''''. In particular, logically, the description of "upgrading" a move and a move "transforming" are contradictory terms (at least insofar as they describe the same thing, but don't use the same word). I (if no one else) will consider some of that a bit, though.
:'''Mechanic''': Um. What?? I'm really not sure what you're trying to talk about. But...you can equip and unequip Z-Crystals just fine.
:'''Snorlium Z''': Snorlium Z is a Z-Crystal, of course it'll be in the Z-Crystals pocket (and of course you'll be able to unequip it from Muchlax). And a Z-Crystal is set into a Z-Ring and "[http://www.pokemon-sunmoon.com/en-us/z-moves/ If a Pokémon holds the '''same variety''' of Z-Crystal, the two will be able to resonate with one another.]" If Snorlax is holding Snorlium Z, Normalium Z will not cut it. (Realistically, it'll probably be very difficult to have a Z-Crystal held but not in the Bag—but not impossible.)
:'''Z-Power''': I kind of want to give Z-Power a page. (Or it may fit here or something.) But we'll probably need to hear a good deal more first.
:'''Category''': I really don't know what you're trying to say here either.
:'''Other''': It's already on this page: Z-Moves do use the base move's PP. And the power and status moves' compatability and stuff, these are the sort of thing we simply need to wait for the games to come out to answer.
:(I may have skipped something in that wall of text... I.e., if something wasn't answered, feel free to repeat it.)
:[[User:Tiddlywinks|Tiddlywinks]] ([[User talk:Tiddlywinks|talk]]) 19:49, 25 October 2016 (UTC)
::'''Terms''': Not trying to.
::'''Mechanic''': I think you don't equip the item you select in your bag, but a held item of the same name (for the type ones). They multiply, create held items. (German description: "Wird bei Bedarf automatisch vervielfacht." Will be multiplied/duplicated when needed.)
::'''Snorlium''': I agree to the "of course", but we don't technically know. Your quote does not prove my "theory" wrong. I still think they're likely held items only.
::'''Z-Power''': Agree.
::'''Category''': Z-Moves could be status moves, and/or not do damage. The power and stuff is in brackets because we have no way to already know (but it's somewhat related to the other part).
::'''Other''': What's on the page is not what I asked for. [[User:Nescientist|Nescientist]] ([[User talk:Nescientist|talk]]) 20:26, 25 October 2016 (UTC)
:::If "draw upon" PP means more than just copy, then it is there. Sorry. [[User:Nescientist|Nescientist]] ([[User talk:Nescientist|talk]]) 20:33, 25 October 2016 (UTC)

== Z-Move types ==

can someone add types for the Z-Moves? or unprotect the page? {{unsigned|Splatterboy}}
:All Z-Moves that have confirmed types have their types listed on this page. If the type is not listed, that means the type is currently unconfirmed (even if it is obvious). --[[User:SnorlaxMonster|'''Snorlax''']][[User talk:SnorlaxMonster|'''Monster''']] 14:43, 31 October 2016 (UTC)

== Mega Raquayza ==

If a Mega Rayquaza is holding a Z-Stone, and it know Dragon Ascent, will it be able to Mega Evolve and use a Z-Move? Or is there something in the game that prevents this from happening? {{unsigned|Yater31}}
:[https://twitter.com/pokemon_PhD/status/797358590814285824 According to Omega Donut] (who is one of the dataminers), Rayquaza cannot Mega Evolve if it is holding a Z-Crystal. --[[User:SnorlaxMonster|'''Snorlax''']][[User talk:SnorlaxMonster|'''Monster''']] 15:57, 8 December 2016 (UTC)
::Should we add that under the trivia section ([[User:Yater31|Yater31]] ([[User talk:Yater31|talk]]) 17:12, 8 December 2016 (UTC))

== Power Calculation ==

The Power calculation states that a move with a base power of 20, when powered up into a Z-move will usually have a base power of 100. However, for a move with variable base power such as {{m|Power Trip}}, which has a displayed base power of 20, creates a Z-move with a base power of 160. This is likely because Power Trip can vary in base power, however, no matter how much stronger the actually base power of Power Trip is, It always creates a Z-move with a power of 160. This is true for all moves with variable base power such as {{m|Gyro Ball}}, {{m|Heavy Slam}}, and {{m|Grass Knot}}. This information is in contradiction with what the article says, therefore, shouldn't this fact be clarified in the article? ([[User:Yater31|Yater31]] ([[User talk:Yater31|talk]]) 17:50, 8 December 2016 (UTC))
:Good catch! However, please note that just linking to [[:Category:Moves that have variable power]] will not be enough to include all exceptions; some moves that are (currently) listed as {{cat|moves that power up}} do also not fit that pattern. Until someone finds a better formulation, I think the current formulation ("for moves with fixed base powers") may be quite sufficient. [[User:Nescientist|Nescientist]] ([[User talk:Nescientist|talk]]) 18:46, 8 December 2016 (UTC)
::Why doesn't someone just create a move category called "Moves with abnormal Z-Power Calculation"? ([[User:Yater31|Yater31]] ([[User talk:Yater31|talk]]) 05:46, 9 December 2016 (UTC))
:::I've found out that [[Multi-strike move#2-5 strikes per turn|moves of 2-5 strikes per turn]] use their 3-hit power for the calculation; [[Multi-strike move#2 strikes per turn|moves of 2 strikes]] and [[Multi-strike move#3 strikes per turn|moves of 3 strikes]] their 2- and 3-hit power (which includes {{m|Gear Grind}}); and most of [[:Category:Moves that have variable power]] their unmodified power (e.g. 150 for {{m|Eruption}} and 120 for {{m|Wring Out}}), or their median or the bigger of the two middle values in their set of values (e.g. 70 for {{m|Magnitude}} and 80 for {{m|Grass Knot}}). I think the prevalence of 80 in this way has made 160 a "standard" for "the exceptions," the Z-moves from moves such as {{m|Return}} and {{m|Power Trip}}. More rigorous analysis are welcome, though.--[[User:Earthoul|Earthoul]] ([[User talk:Earthoul|talk]]) 13:00, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

== List of all Z-Moves ==

Do we need to compile a finite list of all Z-Moves, including all the ones for status moves? Because otherwise, we have to go to each individual status move's page to see what effect(s) its corresponding Z-Move will have.--[[User:Rithvikkiran|Rithvikkiran]] ([[User talk:Rithvikkiran|talk]]) 16:07, 20 January 2017 (UTC)
:No, you don't have to. This page already lists all the status move Z-effects in the section ''Z-Power effects of status moves''. [[User:Pumpkinking0192|Pumpkinking0192]] ([[User talk:Pumpkinking0192|talk]]) 16:23, 20 January 2017 (UTC)

Wow, I must have completely missed that whole section. Thanks.--[[User:Rithvikkiran|Rithvikkiran]] ([[User talk:Rithvikkiran|talk]]) 18:53, 20 January 2017 (UTC)

== Priority and Redirection ==

The page is missing information about how the Z-Moves are affected by the original move's priority bracket and by priority-granting or priority-blocking Abilities.

Also redirection via moves (Follow Me, Rage Powder etc) and Abilities (Lightning Rod, Storm Drain) - works on Z-Moves or not?
[[User:Eworm|Eworm]] ([[User talk:Eworm|talk]]) 18:40, 10 May 2017 (UTC)
:In regard to priority, status Z-Moves should keep their priority, but for damaging Z-Moves, power and category (physical/special) are the only things that are affected by the base move, so priority should always be neutral.
:I've added your question about redirection to the move research template on the page. [[User:Pumpkinking0192|Pumpkinking0192]] ([[User talk:Pumpkinking0192|talk]]) 18:53, 10 May 2017 (UTC)

== I want to make the effects for Status Z-moves sortable, but it isn't working in preview. ==

I deleted class=unsortable in the table, hit preview, but when I hit the arrows, nothing seems to happen. I want to see which Z-moves raise all stats & I'm not sure what to do. Is this fixable? [[User:Unowninator|¿¡Unowninator?!]] ([[User talk:Unowninator|talk]]) 21:17, 17 June 2017 (UTC)
:Not quite sure what you did, but thank you once again SnorlaxMonster. [[User:Unowninator|¿¡Unowninator?!]] ([[User talk:Unowninator|talk]]) 16:00, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

== The graphs are unsortable again. ==

I don't know if it's my new laptop or what, but for some reason all the tables here are unsortable. What's wrong? Can this be fixed somehow? [[User:Unowninator|¿¡Unowninator?!]] ([[User talk:Unowninator|talk]]) 17:20, 7 January 2018 (UTC)
:I've heard that it's a known issue with Chrome --[[User:Celadonkey|Celadonkey]] 17:23, 7 January 2018 (UTC)
::I'm using Internet Explorer. Also, it seems that the show/hide thing is broken, because the Pandora's Box on my userpage starts open & won't close. I can't even edit it because they're blocking the Edit tab. [[User:Unowninator|¿¡Unowninator?!]] ([[User talk:Unowninator|talk]]) 17:27, 7 January 2018 (UTC)

== Concept Art Trainers? ==

In one original concept art, the trainer falls to the ground in a weakened state after their Pokémon surrounded themselves in their Z-power. Maybe it was brought back for Ultra Necrozma's Z-move? I don't want to add that in because I don't have the concept art. [[User:Jonny Kabuto|Jonny Kabuto]] ([[User talk:Jonny Kabuto|talk]]) 22:46, 13 April 2018 (UTC)

==Z-Move poses for each gender?==
Most of the Z-Moves differentiate between gender, so I feel that it's necessary to add another picture of a male trainer doing each Z-Move pose. [[User:B ron 3000|B ron 3000]] ([[User talk:B ron 3000|talk]]) 00:24, 3 September 2018 (UTC)

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Talk:Z-Move