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Talk:Whirl Cup

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Poster

I just noticed that the logo on the poster looks like the haed of a celebi should this be in the trivia or am i over thinking it? Rucario64 01:49, 11 January 2009 (UTC)

I think you're overthinking it. And plus, headers on talk pages should be Level 2 Headers, unless it's a subsection of the current subject. - espeonA 02:01, 11 January 2009 (UTC)
Ohh yeah! Sorry about that thanks anyway!Rucario64 02:22, 11 January 2009 (UTC)

Misty's ranking

In the EP217 "The Perfect Match!", after the win of Trinity against Misty, the commentator says that she is advancing to the semi-finals so Misty made Top 8, Ash Top 16 and so on, no? - unsigned comment from LeoKetchumB (talkcontribs)

From the episode's article's Errors section:
Also in the English dub, the announcer says that the winner of the third round match between Misty and Trinity would advance to the semi-finals, but the fourth round of a 64-member tournament would be the quarter-finals (64→32→16→8).
It might not hurt to mention this discrepancy somewhere on this article, however. --Pie ~ 17:05, 2 April 2014 (UTC)
New argument in the EP226 "Espeon, Not Included", Misty tells Sakura that she has finished Top 8 and Ash Top 16 --LeoKetchumB (talk) 15:09, 8 April 2014 (UTC)
That was also an error: Misty says that she was in the "Best 8" of the Whirl Cup and Ash was in the "Best 16", but they were really in the "Best 16" and "Best 32", respectively. This error was probably a result of the earlier made error. Because we know for certain the battle between Misty and Trinity was a third round match, and that the Whirl Cup has 64 participants. That undoubtedly means the winner of Misty vs. Trinity went to the fourth round, which is quarterfinals, which is Top 8 and as such Misty ended Top 16 and Ash ended Top 32. There's no doubt about this, it's only that the writers screwed up with the rankings two times. ☼ BlazingFist ☼ 15:46, 8 April 2014 (UTC)
Actually, I'm pretty sure it would be Champion (final round winner), then Top 2 (final round runner up), then Top 4 (semi-finals), then Top 8 (quarter-finals), then Top 16, then Top 32, then Top 64, then everyone else, so in point of fact, Misty would actually be Top 8, not Top 16, and likewise Ash would in fact be Top 16. Think the Silver Conference or the other leagues, as they generally do those kinds of multipliers. Also, Misty and Trinity were actually the quarter-finals. Trinity and the Feraligatr trainer were the semi-finals [that much was made very clear not just from the dialogue but also from the visuals of the ending of the episode], and whoever that trainer fought against was the finals. Weedle Mchairybug (talk) 02:32, 23 December 2014 (UTC)
EDIT: Correction: Since the match Trinity lost to was the finals (not just stated, but also made clear from the awards ceremony in terms of visuals), that would actually make Misty top 4, not top 8. Likewise, that would make Ash top 8, not top 16. 02:38, 23 December 2014 (UTC)
Reopening this older discussion for good purpose. I hope we can finally close this case once and for all. Let's rearrange the facts:
1. There are 64 competitors in the final round. This is a fact, look at the tournament chart at the end of "Dueling Heroes".
2. Ash battles Christopher, while Misty battles Harrison in the first round (64). This is also a fact, stated through dialogue.
3. Ash and Misty's battle takes place in the second round (32). Stated so through dialogue, also confirmed through the tournament chart.
4. Misty's and Trinity's battle takes place in the third round (16). Misty has had no off-screen battles after her match with Ash, as the night after their match they talk about it in video conversation with Oak. That same moment, Trinity comes up to Misty and announces herself as her next opponent, and she clearly states: in the third round. The next day, at the beginning of their match, the announcer states: only 16 competitors left.
5. The announcer also does say "semi-finals", which is top 4, but we should either take this with a grain of salt or consider it an error. Everything else up to this point has made clear that Misty vs. Trinity is a top 16 battle. Further evidence: at the beginning of the match the judge says: "same rules as second round". After the match, the announcer and Misty both mention semi-finals again, but again let's consider this an error.
6. Now, this is were it gets foggy with Trinity. I'm pretty sure her match against the Feraligatr Trainer is the finals and she ended runner-up, since why else would she be standing next to the winner? At the start of their match, the announcer didn't make any mention of a round, he only said "moving on to the second round of the day", which could mean anything. Since I perfectly explained how Misty vs. Trinity was Top 16, and her match against the Feraligatr Trainer is probably the finals, that means they skipped the fourth round (quarter-finals, top 8) and fifth round (semi-finals, top 4) matches of Trinity, which as such probably took place off-screen. This makes sense to me, because why should they have showed them? She's a minor character. Concluding, the multiple mention of "semi-finals" could also not be an error, but a deliberate choice. For the Whirl Cup, the semi-finals is probably a combination of the quarter-finals and semi-finals, although we will never be sure. In the Silver Conference, the word semi-final was used for the round-robin tournament (top 48), while the top 16 were called the final rounds.
7. Conclusion: Ash Top 32, Misty Top 16, Trinity Runner-up. Discussion closed if you ask me. ☼ BlazingFist ☼ 14:18, 26 June 2015 (UTC)
Wouldn't it be more objective and neutral to just mention how exact ranking of Misty in Whirl Cup is unclear(whether she was top 8 or top 16). Due to so many contradictions and weird ranking system seeming to take place in Whirl Cup?

You mentioned how there were no of screen battles after battle with Ash, but fact of not all rounds being showed in Whirl Cup does give indication how writers may had skipped one of rounds in which Misty participated before facing Ash without being mentioned or covered up.

There also exist various information in Whirl Cup contradicting each other. For instance why would announcer mention both before Misty vs Trinity how winner gets on semi finals and confirming so once again after battle ended? Even Ash, Misty and Brock further confirmed on that through dialogue when saying how they will be cheering for her in "tomorrow semi finals". And logic says how semi finals would mean best 4 trainers facing each other(at least that's how ranking in most tournaments works).

We could apply this to errors, but than how can we know how mention of Misty facing Trinity in "third round" of Whirl Cup wasn't error too, and semi finals was accurate state of things?

Especially when Misty herself said again to her friend Sakura in episode "Espeon Not Included!" how she came top 8, while Ash ended among top 16?

There exists too many uncertainties that we can't be 100% sure what place in end Misty reached there varying between top 16 and top 8. Because there exists evidence for both of them to be true.--Pokemon fan 132 (talk) 07:02, 4 July 2015 (UTC)