User talk:Force Fire

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Japanese names, no english

Hi there! I have one little problem with some pages, because some of the pages that have the template {{Japanese name|rom}} do have the text 'He/She is unnamed in the English dub, simply referred to as >Name<.' and some don't. So I began editing those who are not from the anime, and there were quite a lot of both. So someone said I should contact a staff member before beginning to make all those edits. So now I'm contacting to you, what should we do? Remove those lines if they are there, or make them if the aren't? Thanks! Lokki (talk) 08:25, 3 September 2016 (UTC)

I think stating that a character is unnamed when the template already says it is unnecessary, so I'd say remove those that do have that extra line.--ForceFire 09:43, 3 September 2016 (UTC)
All right, thanks Lokki (talk) 13:48, 4 September 2016 (UTC)
Done! Thank you very much. Lokki (talk) 14:26, 4 September 2016 (UTC)

Pokémon with gender differences in the anime

How come some Pokémon that have gender differences are allowed to have their genders confirmed while others are not allowed? --PKMNAdventurer (talk) 04:13, 4 September 2016 (UTC)

Both variants of the gender has to appear in order for us to use gender differences. A female Gyarados has not appeared in the anime yet, so for all we know, the animators could decide that all Gyarados (male and female) have skin colored whiskers Just because they've showed Pikachu's gender difference, does not mean all other gender differences are confirmed to exist. Games=/=anime. The animators can decide to change it up because they just can--ForceFire 04:33, 4 September 2016 (UTC)


Once again me and him are having disagreements over wording, specifically whether it should be "XY135/XY136" or "XY135 or XY136". Now he's acting really disruptive and stuck-up with this edit summary. He needs a lesson in manners. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 18:06, 8 September 2016 (UTC)

But I don't. You need a big lesson in hypocrisy and you need to learn that you shouldn't be changing edits when they don't need to be changed. Playerking95 (talk) 18:09, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
And I would like to know what harm is being posed by my edits when the readers can't even see that part of the content? GrammarFreak01 (talk) 18:10, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
Seriously, hypocrisy. Do you at ALL know what it means, because if you do, then realise that if it doesn't matter, then why did you change it in the first place and why did you make something longer when you said shorter sentences were better? Please, answer me that, at the very least. Playerking95 (talk) 18:14, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
I thought others agreed with me that it doesn't really matter? And did you really just undo my last post? GrammarFreak01 (talk) 18:16, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
I don't care what the others think and I have said that it's stupid anyway. Edits should be made to make things better, not the same and it does matter to me, so just answer the questions. And yes, I did undo your post, but it was an accident, honestly. Playerking95 (talk) 18:20, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
Well, yes, there is no difference, but I don't care what anyone else thinks. Who uses / for "or" anyway? And like I said, it's clearly not harming anything. And I'm not convinced that you undid my post on accident. You've got an attitude and you show it when others challenge your work. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 18:24, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
Well clearly you don't care what anyone else thinks, because you're getting your way, even though it's horribly unfair to me and many other editors here who posted things which were fine in the first place. The little guy never gets his side heard and I added an "/" as a placeholder because they might just appear in one episode, and then I or someone else can delete the "/" and the episode that it doesn't appear in or I or someone else could add brackets and the word and. Your way implies that there could be no "and". And about the deletion of the post, I used the history section and clicked undo to check your edit to the page, like I do with most pages and if you don't believe me, well, and I believe I'm in my right to say this, since it's not a big deal, I don't care. Believe me, don't believe, but I know that it was an accident, because we all make them. Playerking95 (talk) 18:32, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
You undid one of my edits here YET AGAIN. I'm really not convinced you're doing this on accident. If that's the way you edit articles then I'm not seeing it in your immediate edit history; you've only been doing this here ever since I reported you. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 18:36, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
Again, it was an accident, because I was too focused on responding to your posts after checking it and there's no point in reporting this, since I did nothing wrong, since it was only an accident. And you need to calm down, accidents happen, you can easily undo it and it's not the end of the world. But you're still going off topic, so please answer the questions about the hypocrisy. Playerking95 (talk) 18:40, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
I DID answer your question, aren't you reading? And also, you need to calm down when someone makes harmless changes to your edits. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 18:42, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
No you didn't and does it really matter isn't an answer, I want to know why you think your similar edits are fine, when they are basically the same thing, and why you've backflipped on your shorter is better rule, unless you're just trying to make sure that only you are editing here. Also, I am calm and from your second most previous post, you are not, so please calm down and I'm just talking about my edits, I'm talking about most of your edits in general, so please read what I'm saying. Playerking95 (talk) 18:51, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
THIS was my answer: "Well, yes, there is no difference, but I don't care what anyone else thinks. Who uses / for "or" anyway? And like I said, it's clearly not harming anything." And since WHEN did I have a "shorter is better" rule? GrammarFreak01 (talk) 18:54, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
Okay, answer this simple question. If there's no harm and there's no difference, then why edit it in the first place? And you told me that it was better to have reappeared instead of appeared again, because it simpler and there is no way that the edit is simpler then it being shorter. Yet, you're making my edits longer, even though they are hidden and they'll be changed soon. Playerking95 (talk) 19:00, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
Because why not? It's not hurting ANYTHING. And I said I understood the difference between "reappear" and "appear again". The / and or part, I DO NOT understand. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 19:09, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
It is, because it hurts my feelings and other feelings when their edits are changed to something similar, just for no one to care about this and if it doesn't harm anything, which it does, then please don't do it in the first place. I'm fine with you fixing mistakes and adding original content, but please, please stop changing things like that and I explain the "/" thing. So, since it's hidden and there not much of a difference, please leave it in future and then we can put this all behind us and maybe even get along. I'm not a bad guy, I just get annoyed when I feel that there's an injustice taking place. It's not that big of a request really. Playerking95 (talk) 19:14, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
We'll let Force Fire be the judge of that. Force Fire, where are you? Take care of this. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 19:17, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
Great, I'm nice to you and then you ask someone to come here who is already on your side. This is something we can just settle between us. If you see an incorrectly spelled word, bad use of grammar, or other things like that, then you can edit them, and you made such edit son Meyer's page and I think also Steven Stone's page recently and I have no problems with those, so why can't you just make those kinds of edits and not change things so that they're basically the same edits, when they're fine and it does cause me and possibly others harm by doing this. I just don't see why we can't just be okay with this? Playerking95 (talk) 19:23, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
No. If our previous interaction (and everyone else's contributions to said interaction) was anything to go by, you definitely have an attitude when things don't go your way, whatever that way may be. And I can tell we're definitely not going to see eye to eye with anything. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 19:28, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
I don't have an attitude problem, even if others say so, because none of you know me, so you are definitely wrong about that, among other things and yes, we won't see eye to eye, when you are fine with treating people unfairly, and also, please post in the correct order next time and don't change previous posts, I have told you this before, but I honestly don't believe you actually pay attention to half of what I say and as I've said countless times, it isn't harmless and even if it was, then there's NO reason to do it in the first place. There's no use trying to talk to any of you, because you're obviously not listening, or you don't care about what's fair or both, but I guess that's what happens when the little guy never gets his voice heard. Playerking95 (talk) 19:36, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
"I don't have an attitude problem, even if others say so, because none of you know me..." This discussion seems to say otherwise. "...I honestly don't believe you actually pay attention to half of what I say and as I've said countless times, it isn't harmless and even if it was, then there's NO reason to do it in the first place." I DO pay attention to what you're saying; don't think I'm being ignorant about this issue. And yes, there IS A REASON to do it in the first place, because who in the world uses a / in the place of "or"? GrammarFreak01 (talk) 19:41, 8 September 2016 (UTC)

"it hurts my feelings and other feelings when their edits are changed to something similar" It's a wiki, get over it. Your edits are going to be changed; that's how wikis work. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 19:26, 8 September 2016 (UTC)

Yes, I actually DO know that, but they shouldn't be unnecessarily changed. Playerking95 (talk) 19:28, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
But maybe those changes would be harmless because technically no one is seeing it yet. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 19:29, 8 September 2016 (UTC)
Woah. Okay, first things first. Hidden notes don't really have to be edited, their hidden, not like anyone is going to see it and nitpick at it. So yes, editing hidden notes is unnecessary and kind of pointless, they can be edited when they are ready to be unhidden. What else is unnecessary is this edit summary Playerking, don't act like you know everything. You continual reverting clearly prove that. I thought I told you to go to a talk page before clicking the undo button? Don't just revert something you don't like, because knowing you, it'll just end up in a back and forth edit war.
Side note, why are you using the undo button to respond to others Playerking? It's clearly done you no favors , seeing as you accidentally removed some of GrammarFreak's comments.--ForceFire 05:33, 9 September 2016 (UTC)
But the thing is, who uses / in the place of "or"? It's such an unusual usage of punctuation. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 07:43, 9 September 2016 (UTC)
Yeah, "/" should not be used when linking hidden things, as someone might miss the "/" when their unhiding the info. Nevertheless, it can get removed/updated when it is ready to be unhidden. Just don't worry too much about it or any hidden content, like I said, no one is going to see it and nitpick at it.--ForceFire 07:47, 9 September 2016 (UTC)
Well, I'm sorry, but I am very obsessive about these things and will not care about whether it is hidden or not. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 08:00, 9 September 2016 (UTC)

Why did you remove the trivia I added?

Why did you remove the trivia I added on the M18 page? I am referring to this page: - unsigned comment from Awesomevenustoise101 (talkcontribs)

Because things shown in trailers are either never actually shown in the movie or are different in the movie than the trailer. It's a common thing that is to be expected.--ForceFire 16:38, 10 September 2016 (UTC)

Ash's Sligoo/Goodra

Sent you an email regarding a voice actor, just wondering if you take this as confirmation--BigDocFan (talk) 20:31, 10 September 2016 (UTC)

Okay, cool. Feel free to add those.--ForceFire 06:34, 11 September 2016 (UTC)

official sources

It seems like information can only be from official sources or by playing, watching reading the specific Pokémon product but what if the information on the unofficial source is true? Awesomevenustoise101 (talk) 19:05, 12 September 2016 (UTC)

Find where that unofficial source got their information from, and if it comes from an official source, then site the official source not the unofficial source.--ForceFire 04:25, 13 September 2016 (UTC)

Contributions and edits and talking

I wasn't trying to make an edit war. I was just trying to contribute to the pages and the talk pages on here are very confusing. I am not sure why someone made a re-edit and didn't message me beforehand? I have been adding things I have noticed that while watching Pokémon and the errors they have made in the English dubbed version. Maybe there should be an easier way to message each other like a mail system or a chat box? I was only trying to help expand on things throughout the show that have happened. Please leave a message back. Raziel 5 (talk) 18:14, 14 September 2016 (UTC)

I said why I removed it in the edit summary, the errors are either too minor or not errors at all. If your edit has been removed, don't just add it right back, go to the talk page of the user that reverted you. And the talk page is the most effective way of sorting out discussions/problems about articles.--ForceFire 05:16, 15 September 2016 (UTC)
Well, I find it very confusing that you have to edit someone's page to talk to them unless there is another way to do so? Sorry and is there anyway for you to remove the edit warring thing off the page? I was just really confused on how the pages work. I noticed also when you go to the edit top page thing on my profile even if you go out it is no longer there and just says edit this page? Not sure if that is an error in the website or what. Also no one has addressed my question Azumarill vs. Wartortle. Bubble or Bubble Beam? on Talk:EP216. Hoping someone can clear up either what attack it was or whether or not it was an error on Misty's part? Raziel 5 (talk) 14:46, 15 September 2016 (UTC)
How is going directly to the user's talk page to communicate with them confusing? This is something that should only be discussed on Bulbapedia, not elsewhere. I can delete revision history (if that's what you mean), but I don't see the need to. If you meant restore the edit that you made, then no, I'ce already given my reasons for their removal.
Someone will respond to your message on EP216's talk page when they do, have some patience. Also, sign your comments at the end of your comments, not at the beginning. And indent your comments by adding a colon, and more as the discussion progresses, so you would add four colons after my comment if you were to respond to me, and I would add five colons before my comment if I were to respond back, so on so forth.--ForceFire 15:18, 15 September 2016 (UTC)
It's confusing because like on this page we are chatting on it doesn't notify me when you put something new even though it is watched. Not sure why it doesn't notify me of that? The history and contributions and editing on the pages kind of baffled me at first , too. I guess revision history is what I meant? I believe you meant to put I've not I'ce? Guessing keyboard or finger slipped? I have also watched Pokémon since 1997 in the USA when it was released on television by Pioneer Entertainment.Raziel 5 (talk) 16:21, 15 September 2016 (UTC)
Users are only notified if someone edits their talk page, you don't get notified if I edit my talk page. The only way to know if someone has responded to your message on a talk page that's not yours is to have it on your watchlist or lurk the recent changes. If you meant revision history, I'm not deleting it as I don't see the need to.--ForceFire 07:53, 16 September 2016 (UTC)

Branched evolutions

We explicitly treat Mega Evolutions the same way we do for alternate forms for purposes like infoboxes and time switches, so why would we not treat Megas in the same way we treat Wormadam's alternate forms on List of Pokémon with branched evolutions? It seems like a no-brainer to me. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 05:50, 17 September 2016 (UTC)

A part of Burmy's evolution into Wormadam relies on which form it is when it evolves. Whereas Mega Evolution is straightforward and is not dependent on the "pre-evolved" form--ForceFire 05:53, 17 September 2016 (UTC)

Megalith page

Hey, there. I have a question. Would it be alright if we make a page for the Megalith? Seabiscuit2020 (talk) 19:47, 17 September 2016 (UTC)

Fairy type

So does the fairy type exist or not? Because we have seen in that chapter that they exist from moves like misty terrain and Pokemon like diancie. It's really unprofessional to get rid of legit information because "they haven't discovered it yet", because they clearly exist. If they are not confirmed then the moves should be unconformed as well. Don't let the wiki fence ride.--Pikablu (talk) 17:57, 23 September 2016 (UTC)

Using a Fairy type move in a Gen VI era manga doesn't make the move a fairy type? That rule only goes for Pokémon and moves that changed types and gained the new type. If a Pokémon used Bite and has been using Bite since Generation I, then the template will show the move as a Normal type unless specified as a Dark type move. If it learns Bite post Gen I instead, then the template will show it as a Dark type.--ForceFire 03:29, 24 September 2016 (UTC)

Video on EP 38 proof public now

I just fixed the video publicity, now everyone can view it. Sorry for that. I'm new to a wiki like this so I have alot to learn. - unsigned comment from TheGreenBeetle (talkcontribs)

That's okay, take your time with learning how the wiki works. I'll add the info in and fix the reference for you. Also, don't forget to sign with four tildes (~) after every comment, and don't re-sign an unsigned comment as it will give off the wrong timestamp.--ForceFire 04:26, 26 September 2016 (UTC)

"Intended for mainspace" pages

Do pages like this one follow the userspace policy on limited edits per day? sumwun (talk) 21:01, 2 October 2016 (UTC)

The rules are a bit more lax for pages for mainspace, but the limit is still there. Your mainspace edits for the day still has to be over your userspace edits per day.--ForceFire 04:09, 3 October 2016 (UTC)

Serperior's Tackle

Hi, I have a doubt. In this page it says that Serperior use Tackle, but in the move's page, in the anime section there isn't Serperior? Why? I ask for security--Naty (talk) 17:05, 4 October 2016 (UTC)

Clemont's Magnemite

Notability rules say that Pokémon that are owned by Clemont are notable if they appeared in more than one episode and Magnemite has finally done that. So can the page User:Rahl/Clemont's Magnemite be moved to the mainspace?--Rahl (talk) 12:15, 6 October 2016 (UTC)

I've brought it up with the other staff members to get second opinions.--ForceFire 12:36, 6 October 2016 (UTC)
Hey I was just wondering how the discussion was going? This one is very similar to Clemont's Magneton so I'm not sure what the problem would be with Magnemite.--Rahl (talk) 17:47, 11 October 2016 (UTC)
ForceFire hasn't been active for a while, might be worth talking with other admin in his absence--BigDocFan (talk) 18:35, 11 October 2016 (UTC)
Thanks, I will--Rahl (talk) 19:47, 11 October 2016 (UTC)
BigDocFan. please don't speak for me, I was simply offline. The we are currently discussing ways to update the notability page so small, two paragraph pages like this doesn't creep into the notability requirements.--ForceFire 04:26, 12 October 2016 (UTC)

Ash's Greninja

Can you do me a favor and unlock the Ash's Greninja please? I need to add something it did during XY137. When I'm done, I'll let you lock to page until further notice. --Seabiscuit2020 (talk) 20:17, 7 October 2016 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure pages get protected so that users can only edit the talk pages and the staff edit the page for you if your suggestion was good enough. sumwun (talk) 01:18, 12 October 2016 (UTC)

Table formatting

# Pokémon HP Attack Defense Sp. Attack Sp. Defense Speed Total EVs
015 015 Beedrill 0 2 0 0 1 0 0 3

How do I get the colors in the second row to display correctly and remove the "0" from the last column? - unsigned comment from Sumwun (talkcontribs)

please explain

I could understand my trivia point on Gallade/Froslass being removed because it's unnecessary, too coincidental, or false (seeing as Ralts is actually dual-typed now), but how is it opinion and the other "parallel" trivia points (Phanpy, Noivern, Gothita, etc.) aren't? Nutter Butter (talk) 20:39, 17 October 2016 (UTC)


Is the recurring Florges good enough to get its own page? It helped a lot with Goodras development which is important to the plot, kinda similar to Ash's raticate.--Pikablu (talk) 04:33, 19 October 2016 (UTC)

While I do think it is notable for an article, the staff would like to focus on the Sun and Moon stuff first.--ForceFire 05:14, 19 October 2016 (UTC)
that's good but there is already a page for it. Would it be too much right now to move it over? I'm fine waiting just curious.--Pikablu (talk) 11:41, 19 October 2016 (UTC)
Talked with the others and the page is fine to be mainspaced now if you'd like.--ForceFire 13:12, 19 October 2016 (UTC)

Article-less talk page deletion

Hi! You deleted the discussion page I created for a missing article because the article itself was missing. I created this page because I do not have permission to create new pages. I'm note entirely sure on why (FAQ had nothing on this), but as a result I created a talk page suggesting its creation instead. If this is the wrong way to go about things, then where should I suggest creations in the future? This is a minor case since I just suggested a redirect, but it would be good to know in general as well. FIQ (talk) 17:15, 20 October 2016 (UTC)

Bring it up on a talk page of an existing article, in this case, the talk page of Status condition would've worked just fine.--ForceFire 17:31, 20 October 2016 (UTC)


So what about Chespie? Is it good enough?--Pikablu (talk) 23:29, 20 October 2016 (UTC)

Approved, feel free to mainspace it.--ForceFire 06:32, 21 October 2016 (UTC)
I tried to move it but it won't let me because a page with that name already exists, which I think is just a redirect. How do I fix this? Also since I'm here is Diantha's Gardevoir good enough?--Pikablu (talk) 12:21, 21 October 2016 (UTC)
Ah, right. The redirect has to be deleted first before you can move it, I've moved it for you. I've brought up Diantha's Gardevoir for the other sot review.--ForceFire 13:09, 21 October 2016 (UTC)
Gardevoir approved and moved.--ForceFire 16:01, 21 October 2016 (UTC)

Ash's Bayleef

May I ask why you removed that {{fact}} tag without giving a reason in your edit summary? That is unsourced information and it does need a source to prove it.Ratchet and Clank 1995 (talk) 08:39, 27 October 2016 (UTC)

Please read this section very carefully.--ForceFire 08:57, 27 October 2016 (UTC)
That's on the talk page it needs to be sourced in the main article. It doesn't say in which episode that happened.Ratchet and Clank 1995 (talk) 09:21, 27 October 2016 (UTC)
Why did you also do it on Ash's Krookodile?Ratchet and Clank 1995 (talk) 09:22, 27 October 2016 (UTC)
See EP136 trivia. As for Krookodile, read its talk page.--ForceFire 09:42, 27 October 2016 (UTC)

Ash's Krookodile's page needs to source the episode in which that happened. I couldn't find the episode myself so it needs sourcing. Until then I'm going to add that tag back.Ratchet and Clank 1995 (talk) 08:54, 28 October 2016 (UTC)

True about Gabby, Ty, and Cheryl

But I was right about Gabby being voiced by Michelle Ruff, Ty being voiced by Derek Stephen Prince, and Cheryl being voiced by Stephanie Sheh. I looked that up from Behind the Voice Actor. - unsigned comment from Cameron33268110 (talkcontribs)

You still need to link to it, don't just say it.--ForceFire 04:02, 29 October 2016 (UTC)

Alain's Weaville

Sent you an email, do I have approval--BigDocFan (talk) 10:07, 30 October 2016 (UTC)

My only gripe is that it doesn't really confirm if he voiced Weavile. Always ask more directly, try again.--ForceFire 13:10, 30 October 2016 (UTC)
Emailed you Bill's response, will be more direct with my questions in future--BigDocFan (talk) 22:05, 30 October 2016 (UTC)
Cool, that's better. Feel free to add it in.--ForceFire 03:12, 31 October 2016 (UTC)
Added Bill Rogers but for some reason it isn't coming up - unsigned comment from BigDocFan (talkcontribs)
Thw VA parameter was the other way round ("enva" rather than the proper "vaen"). I've fixed it.--ForceFire 09:42, 31 October 2016 (UTC)
Ah thanks, I'm pleased to be helping Bulbapedia, hopefully I can get some cast lists from Lisa Ortiz soon but she is understandably busy--BigDocFan (talk) 09:46, 31 October 2016 (UTC)

Kanto Pokérap

I did say in the edit summary to provide a source yet you added it back without one. All information must be verifiable so please provide oneRatchet and Clank 1995 (talk) 06:19, 6 November 2016 (UTC)

Not a valid source it's just one person's view on it. The video itself doesn't state any related controversy caused by it and the offence caused to Christians. When sourcing something you have to actually add it into the article itself not in the edit summary. You even added back the {{fact}} tag.Ratchet and Clank 1995 (talk) 16:04, 11 December 2016 (UTC)
Are you going to respond to this because so far there is no evidence to support that point?Ratchet and Clank 1995 (talk) 16:13, 11 December 2016 (UTC)
It's well known that christian fundamentalists have spoken against the franchise.--ForceFire 16:17, 11 December 2016 (UTC)
Well can you provide a source then?Ratchet and Clank 1995 (talk) 16:20, 11 December 2016 (UTC)

Specifically the Pokerap being played backwards.Ratchet and Clank 1995 (talk) 16:27, 11 December 2016 (UTC)

When it's not midnight where I am.--ForceFire 16:29, 11 December 2016 (UTC)
While I'm not able to find any kind of source the past few days, but the source (if any had actually existed) probably died along with the 90s. This is not something that I can just pull out of the internet in a day, we're talking about something that may have not even been documented at all at the time. But it doesn't mean it didn't happen.--ForceFire 16:10, 16 December 2016 (UTC)
But without evidence there is no way of actually confirming it. This makes that information unreliable. For all I (and probably other) know it is an internet myth, it could've just been made up by someone as there is no source on the internet my theory could be correct, meaning it never actually happened. Yes you are right it might have still happened but could I do something similar and say that some people complained about something else. I wouldn't have a source but this bizarre claim would be just as valid as this "I love Satan". This site is meant to be an encyclopedia not a site that has unsourced information about internet myths it is very unprofessional to have this on this site. On a final note for this comment I didn't actually know about the Pokerap backwards before reading it on this site so it could be a case of this site helped to spread this myth. I therefore think this unsourced information be removed.Ratchet and Clank 1995 (talk) 11:04, 17 December 2016 (UTC)
As you haven't responded to this I'm starting to think it's okay to remove that point.Ratchet and Clank 1995 (talk) 10:23, 21 December 2016 (UTC)
No response does not mean it's okay to remove it. Don't expect me to just magically find a source. Like I said, the source (if any) probably died along with the 90s and this sort of thing was probably not documented/taken seriously. But I'm pretty sure one of those Christian folks said something about the Pokerap.--ForceFire 11:58, 21 December 2016 (UTC)

Don't speculate just because you think some Christians said that, it does not mean it's true. Without a source it's unreliable and should ultimately be removed. It's really unprofessional allowing this information to remain on this encyclopaedia.Ratchet and Clank 1995 (talk) 17:26, 21 December 2016 (UTC)

The whole idea of sourcing is so that you can prove to the readers that the information is correct. It doesn't matter that you believed it to happen if you can't provide a source it's inaccurate and should be removed. Why are you allowing it to remain stop being so ridiculous by not replying and ensisting that it remains. The rule to not edit warring is to discuss it well I have and as it turns out a source doesn't exist this is surely a conclusion so the information should be removed.Ratchet and Clank 1995 (talk) 11:45, 26 December 2016 (UTC)


As I am putting in the numbers for the different Alola numbers in the number disambiguation pages I am thinking that it needs to be slightly redone, by listing the general number number first and placing in the other entries as subnotes like this:

This is only because the Alola Pokedex takes a much different approach from the Kalos Pokedex where there is one part that is the number for all the Pokémon, and other for a specific area, instead of just listing one Pokémon in each area. Also despite the appearance of this draft I am sending to you I am willing to remove unneeded links (same Pokémon listed more than once and all DL links except the first one). What do you think? -Tyler53841 (talk) 16:28, 1 December 2016 (UTC)

Sorry to butt in, but if you consult your in-game dex, it's clear that the island dexes don't use different numbering systems for different Pokemon. Brionne is the only #008 in Alola. For example, the Akala Dex starts with #010 Pikipek, continues on through #019 Butterfree, then skips to #027 Grubbin, and so on. The islands just use the same numbers as the overall Alola Dex, even though they have only a subset of the Pokemon. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 16:47, 1 December 2016 (UTC)


Can I say how good it is to have Bulbapedia unlocked, missed contributing to the site, hopefully Lisa Ortiz will send me cast lists soon and hopefully include M19 and SM001 and SM002--BigDocFan (talk) 21:58, 1 December 2016 (UTC)

Erica Schroeder

Sent you an email regarding a post on Facebook, is that valid enough to add the info, just in case it isn't, I have messaged her about it--BigDocFan (talk) 15:28, 2 December 2016 (UTC)

I'll accept that, feel free to add it in.--ForceFire 15:52, 2 December 2016 (UTC)

Kiawe's Turtonator

Perhaps you'd like to look at the edit summaries for this page and deal with your friend or at least clarify why he is allowed to do as he pleases? Diamond Lanturn CodeName: 05308 17:44, 2 December 2016 (UTC)


Hello, I was wondering if it's allowed to have offensive words in one's signature as it doesn't say in our signature policy. --Raltseye prata med mej 18:50, 2 December 2016 (UTC)

That should be common sense, it does not need to be said.--ForceFire 04:02, 3 December 2016 (UTC)
Yes, I thought so too but I just told a user about this refering to it as "against our Signature policy" and realized it didn't say anything about it. Asked just to be sure and to have an authority's statement to fall back on in case he would argue about it, which he didn't, thankfully. Thank you anyway for answering my dumb question. :P --Silly dumbnut Raltseye prata med mej 08:41, 3 December 2016 (UTC)

Random Edits/Sprites

I saw my Talk Page, & I'm sorry, okay? I'm 14, with ADHD, & Aspergers Syndrome. What do you expect from someone who is 63% excited? But I found the sprites for when they get registered into the Dex for Sun & Moon online. Should we use those? - unsigned comment from Hamfart (talkcontribs)

Please don't re-sign an unsigned comment, it gives off the wrong timestamp, or in your case, just don't do it, period. We prefer users to rip the sprites/models from the game rather than taking it from another site without permission.--ForceFire 05:33, 8 December 2016 (UTC)
How do they rip the sprites from the game? That seems difficult.--Hamfart
By using a card capture device.--ForceFire 14:50, 12 December 2016 (UTC)
Where can I find one of those & how is it used?--Hamfart
Just google it. They're very expensive, if you can't afford something pricey, then you're going to have to let someone else do the sprite uploading..--ForceFire 14:55, 12 December 2016 (UTC)

Mewoth Team Rocket's gender

In the page Where no Togepi's Gone before it says that Meowth's gender was confirmed before this. When was it?Ratchet and Clank 1995 (talk) 16:08, 11 December 2016 (UTC)

May's Venusaur

Why do you keep removing the {{fact}} tag without even giving a reason in your edit summary. It needs sourcing to verify that it's female.Ratchet and Clank 1995 (talk) 16:21, 11 December 2016 (UTC)

No, it doesn't. It's clearly a female. Both male and female variant of Venusaur have been shown in the anime, so it's safe to say that it's a female.--ForceFire 16:22, 11 December 2016 (UTC)

Move pages

My question is rather trivial, but I will ask nonetheless. I notice, that on every move page, the column which displayed the Types of the Pokémon that learn a specified move has been replaced by Egg Groups. Is there a particular reason to it, as it seems rather odd to do so now, when the Types are what the move pages go by, since (maybe) the beginning of the site. Harryghost (talk) 16:40, 13 December 2016 (UTC)

I'd like to second this question. It doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me to remove the types; why not list the egg groups alongside the types? To me, the types are a basic piece of information. They're usually listed anywhere Pokemon are listed, whereas egg groups aren't an often used piece of info. Is there a reason for the change? And was there even a discussion aside from one between admins? I feel like input from other users could have been beneficial. slimey01 17:10, 13 December 2016 (UTC)
I don't think he's online ATM, but I can answer this question. If he wishes to add to it, he can do so.
The reason behind the specific species being removed is more of an issue of space. The breeding tables, on Gen. I move pages especially, were starting to get extremely long. So it was decided, instead of listing 20-30 members of the Egg Group who are capable of passing the move via breeding, we instead just list the actual Egg Group. This leaves it to the user to do the research for each speccies within the Egg Group(s) who is capable of learning a breedable move. For instance, when you look at Ice Beam, you see Psyduck can learn it via breeding and is a Water 1/Field pair of Egg Groups; you find either (Seel and Dewgong each in fact satisfy both) and breed it. It's easier than putting a full species list.
The second reason, which relates to this, is because at times there have been errors even within our information, or missing species. Listing just the Egg Group automatically includes everyone in the Egg Group with no errors (provided the Egg Group is correct in the first place).
The question then becomes one of chain breeding identification; ATM, there are notes in the coding about which involve chain breeds, but right now there is no option within the table. Once you identify one that is a chain breed, breed THAT species to get the proper parent and then breed THAT to get the desired result. Even without checking the notes, it might be possible to look for matching Egg Groups in places and figure out the connection; for example, Skrelp (a Water 1/Dragon group) can learn Acid Armor, but needs one of its Egg Groups; this can be done via Shellos, a Water 1/Amphorous, which can directly breed with Grimer or Muk. Coincidentally, Goomy can then pick it up from Skrelp as the third link in the chain, and it's the only way Goomy can get the move. This is how you use the Egg Group informarion to find the parents.
If you have further questions, please reply further. CycloneGU (talk) 20:07, 13 December 2016 (UTC)
That makes sense. I think that's a whole lot more efficient than how it was previously done. Is there a reason the types were removed from the table? slimey01 20:31, 13 December 2016 (UTC)
I personally don't know the exact reason for this. I think it was partly to avoid confusion with Egg Groups in the tables. I do know that STAB is noted, either in bold or italics as necessary, so it may have been deemed unnecessary to include. CycloneGU (talk) 21:51, 13 December 2016 (UTC)

Castform Sprites

I found it logical that Castform should have a Generation VII Spritebox (not trying to get you mad, since I still have lots to learn about the site). Is it okay with you?--Hamfart

Like I said on your talk page, the spriteboxes will be updated/edited by the staff once we have the Gen VII Pokemon sprites, so we can do it all at the same time rather than doing it in batches.--ForceFire 03:41, 16 December 2016 (UTC)
The 1st 721 Pokémon sprites for Gen. VI are USED in Gen. VII, so it's just the Alola forms & the 81 new Pokémon.--Hamfart
We know. We're waiting to have the Alola Pokemon sprites uploaded before updating the first 721 sprites, so we can do it all at once.--ForceFire 12:21, 16 December 2016 (UTC)

Regarding Zygarde

Since it was you who said "It's not considered part of the trio until either the games or the anime explicitly calls them a trio, with the lore and all", and since you're an administrator, could you look at what I wrote on Zygarde's talk page and approve/disapprove my evidence? ----Celadonkey (talk) 14:19, 16 December 2016 (UTC)

I have an extremely limited understanding of the Japanese language and am not going to follow what fansubs say, since they usually take liberties. But I will bring it up with the other staff members and we will discuss it.--ForceFire 16:00, 16 December 2016 (UTC)


Who do I ask so i can upload these animated sprites? PlatinumPokenut (talk) 04:20, 21 December 2016 (UTC)

I was referring to the site you were using to link the images. You have to ask permission from PKParaiso if you want to use their sprites.--ForceFire 04:59, 21 December 2016 (UTC)
Thanks for the tip! :D--Hamfart

I cant seem to find this user. Where do i find this PKParaiso?? Could you put a link there,but if not could you plz help me find him?PlatinumPokenut (talk) 15:59, 21 December 2016 (UTC)

It's a website: [1] ----Celadonkey 16:57, 21 December 2016 (UTC)

Oh. So can i upload BW sprites from Pokecheck if i ask? PlatinumPokenut (talk) 20:03, 21 December 2016 (UTC)

If they give you permission and you can prove that they gave you permission, then yes. Also, your signature should go after your comment, not before.--ForceFire 04:15, 22 December 2016 (UTC)

Issue on the List of Link Templates page

The {{gameabbrev3|GS}} for the gameabbrev section of that page has a minor issue as it is presented with a 3 in that section instead of 2 for the Generation 2 games, which needs to be fixed by an administrator. Just wanted to bring this simple fix to your attention. -Tyler53841 (talk) 17:29, 30 December 2016 (UTC)

Gender Differences edit - Medicham

It appears so to me. Most noticeable in Gen VI. -Uncleben85 (talk) 18:35, 4 January 2017 (UTC)


Re this.

But why is something as redundant and pointless as that done like that on every page? And, if it is done like that on every page, why is that not written in the MOS? And why is it called a translation in the code when it's not a translation?

Seriously, if I am violating a convention that was decided on for some particular reason, could you explain it?

Satorukun0530 (talk) 09:52, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

It's done for consistency, and it's how we have done things for a long time. As for why it's not in the MOS, I don't know. Ask an Editorial Board member. Also, please create a new section on a talk page, don't just add your comment.--ForceFire 10:23, 9 January 2017 (UTC)
I did create a new section. I just forgot to fill in the title. Honestly, I don't know why the software doesn't just fill in "untitled section" or something when forgetful old fuddie-duddies like me make mistakes like that.
Anyway, my understanding of the convention is that when the official English name is a literal translation of the Japanese, then we just repeat the official English name in italics within the parentheses. Doing like you did on that page creates the false impression that the translation inside the parentheses is somehow more accurate/literal than the official English name The reason I don't want to replace the "translated name with a word-for-word repetition of the official English name is that that also doesn't make much sense to me (it's redundant) and I'd rather wait until Nuva-kal gets back to me (or indicates that they are not going to get back to me) before going over their head to the Editorial Board. I'm still waiting on my tiny factual correction to the MOS to be restored, so actually changing the substance of it seems like biting off more than I can chew.
(And I'm guessing you'd be unwilling to fill in and answer my queries in Nuva-kal's stead?)
Satorukun0530 (talk) 01:33, 10 January 2017 (UTC)
General conventions, sure, but it's not our conventions. It's like that to follow what in the infobox, word for word, that's literally all it is - the information on the infobox, but instead it's on first line of the page. As for the removal/replacing, again, redundant or not, it's how we do things and SnorlaxMonster gave a good reason to repeat the translation.
I won't answer for Nuva-kal on this subject, since my knowledge on the Japanese language is limited. As for why you need to go to an Editoarial Board member, they (along with anyone higher than them) aree the policy-makers, they have the final say on any changes to Bulbapedia's policy--ForceFire 05:44, 10 January 2017 (UTC)

A question regarding animated PNGs

So, I've been trying to figure out what's going on here, but come up with nothing. I saw you are a fairly active administrator, and given that the main page says to ask staff if the faqs don't help....

Some, and only some, animated PNGs on this wiki are displaying wrong for me, and nothing I can do seems to fix it. It's mostly with the gen 5 animated sprites like this one (also see that file's talk page for further information). The sprite appears very flickery, as though the apng's dispose method is set wrong, though it does display fine if I download it and view in Irfanview. See here for a screenshot of what I am seeing, in case you don't have the same problem. I am using Waterfox 50.1.0, which uses exactly the same rendering engine as Firefox (and the problem did occur when I was using Firefox as well!). Xolroc (talk) 18:09, 13 January 2017 (UTC)

I've been having the same issue for a little while now. I'm using Firefox updated to the latest version. The images worked fine a few months ago. slimey01 20:40, 13 January 2017 (UTC)
Probably something to do with a Firefox update, something must've gone wrong. Best to ask the staff of Firefox.--ForceFire 04:24, 14 January 2017 (UTC)
Well, if anyone comes up with a solution, please do inform me. I will try to look into it, but I'm unlikely to find anything myself. Xolroc (talk) 04:41, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

Registeel's Hitler Salute?

I don't get what's so irrelevant to the trivia point in Registeel's trivia where it talks about it's sprite. I'm just trying to point out the fact that everyone is wrong if they aren't highly educated enough. Anyone could just look at Registeel's DP sprite and be like, "yep. He's hailing Hitler," but a Nazi Salute is what one would do with their Right Arm, where Registeel's sprite is raising the Left Arm, which is a Roman Salute. Can I please get some understanding on why this general fact is so irrelevant? I'm just trying to clear things out. Bulldogs1234869 (talk) 16:51, 16 January 2017 (UTC)

I already explained on your talk page why: the trivia is detailing why its offensive, any other use for the salute is entirely irrelevant. Also, it doesn't matter if it's the left or the right arm, the pose is still offensive to some (plus the fact the the salute has become so ingrained in Nazi imagery, that the origin has become lost).--ForceFire 16:54, 16 January 2017 (UTC)

Cast lists

Received cast lists for M19 and XY128 - XY136, do I have your approval to add them?--BigDocFan (talk) 11:01, 18 January 2017 (UTC)

Took me a while to see that they were files sent from Ortiz, I'll accept them.--ForceFire 12:19, 18 January 2017 (UTC)
Cheers, for some reason they were sent in a different format than the last ones, hoping to receive more from her soon, hope you are well--BigDocFan (talk) 12:22, 18 January 2017 (UTC)
Do I have approval for the other I sent regarding Popplio, Exeggutor, Bergmite, Litten and Rockruff?--BigDocFan (talk) 13:22, 18 January 2017 (UTC)
That's fine by me.--ForceFire 13:56, 18 January 2017 (UTC)

Mass reversion

Could you please be a bit more careful when reverting a large number of edits? A lot of GrammarFreak01's edits that you reverted were perfectly good edits, such as fixing typos or fixing run-on sentences and awkward wording. slimey01 13:08, 18 January 2017 (UTC)

Dohga and Ether

Looking at the cast lists, only two characters without their dub name revealed, one being Dohga who is male so I assume Levi is his name with Ether being Cherie--BigDocFan (talk) 13:54, 18 January 2017 (UTC)

Probably good to ask Ortiz for clarification.--ForceFire 14:04, 18 January 2017 (UTC)

CotD History sections

There are a number of CotD articles with a "History" section GrammarFreak01 (talk) 04:24, 19 January 2017 (UTC)

The ones that I've checked were added by you, so I doubt it. If you can show me a CotD article that already had a history section that you did not add, then fine. Also, please don't use the section headers to write your comment, use the comment box like it should be used. You should know this already.--ForceFire 04:53, 19 January 2017 (UTC)

How much edits until I can edit my userpage/make pages

Just asking. I want to know. - unsigned comment from Bubblymice (talkcontribs)

Hi Bubblymice. I believe Force Fire is offline at this time of day, so perhaps I can be of assistance to you.
First of all, before even worrying about how to edit userspace, you need to know how to sign a comment on a talk page. This is done by typing ~~~~, the tilde sign. On my keyboard, it's to the left of the number keys on the top row, but other keyboards may have it in other locations. Typing that four tildes gives a signature much like the one at the end of this comment. Please use that when commenting on talk pages as it's easier to track who is saying what.
In regards to your actual question, Force Fire most likely does not know how much you have to edit to gain the ability to edit your userspace. With that said, however, it's important to note that editing userspace is a privilege, not a right. You are required to continue to be helpful to Bulbapedia to even be allowed to edit your userspace. Notice my own personal userspace page; I have had the ability for a long time, and was notorious for always having a userpage redlink, but after a few years finally decided something should be there, so put up what's there. I don't believe I've edited it since, as it's not important and adding all sorts of userspace tags isn't going to help Bulbapedia. So I don't waste my time there. More importantly, however, is the actual userspace policy. I suggest you review it as it gives you this answer: "Your account is not autoconfirmed: a special status is required before you can edit your userpage; this can be automatically earned by editing Bulbapedia's mainspace". You can then head over to the "Autoconfirmed users" page (it's linked here, please follow it) for any questions related to obtaining that status.
Should you have any further questions, please feel free to reply further here. If you do reply, make sure to use colons - that is, : - to indent your reply appropriately. For future concerns, note that it's advised to first contact a Junior Administrator like myself as we are the starting point on the staff hierarchy, and able to answer the most general questions. Questions beyond our scope to answer can then be escalated beyond us to the Administrator level, and so on. We also have direct contact with higher staff and may be able to get an answer for you regardless. Cheers! CycloneGU (talk) 18:01, 19 January 2017 (UTC)

Kiawe's Charizard

Now that Charizard had an important episode is it ready for its own page? It's obvious it will show up again.--Pikablu (talk) 18:19, 21 January 2017 (UTC)

Are you going to answer me? I see you editing a lot.--Pikablu (talk) 06:13, 22 January 2017 (UTC)
I am yet to see the recent episode, so I can't judge whether or not it deserves an article.--ForceFire 06:16, 22 January 2017 (UTC)
Alright. Please get back to me when you get the chance to watch it. Thank you.--Pikablu (talk) 06:21, 22 January 2017 (UTC)
I don't see how it was its own episode. Yes, we know a bit more about its history, but other than that, it was basically only used as a Ride Pokemon. Playerking95 (talk) 08:06, 22 January 2017 (UTC)

Claire voice section coding error

This page is blocked from editing and there's a coding error for her "Voice actresses" section (one extra "="). 20:58, 22 January 2017 (UTC)

Bringing a vandal to your attention

Since the recent changes page isn't going to keep it visible under a flood of new edits, I thought I would bring this up here: A user by the name of Poképowder keeps deleting vast swaths of seemingly-random pages and replacing them with something about a "hula revenge party"--this is the second time this has happened. See Special:Contributions/Poképowder. --Felthry (F.K.A. Xolroc) (talk) 21:14, 22 January 2017 (UTC)

Never mind. Another administrator blocked the user in question while I was typing this. --Felthry (F.K.A. Xolroc) (talk) 21:15, 22 January 2017 (UTC)


I'm dying to see the Gen. VII sprites on this website. And since I'm unable to upload them, when will they be? --Hamfart

Well, considering that our Gen VI sprites aren't even complete... Honestly, I don't think we should use the models for the sprites. There are still images of each Pokémon available in the game from the Pokédex which I think would be better, such as [2] for Gen VI and [3] for Gen VII. (Not saying we should take from Spriters Resource, but you get the idea.) --Celadonkey 19:03, 26 January 2017 (UTC)
Hamfart, they'll be uploaded eventually. Have patience.--ForceFire 03:31, 27 January 2017 (UTC)
Will they be screencaps of the Pokémon inbattle, like we have done in the past for Gen VI, or will it be the Pokédex sprites like I showed above? Because I could help upload the images if I know which. --Celadonkey 13:03, 27 January 2017 (UTC)
Not too sure, but I presume we're getting the in battle sprites.--ForceFire 04:43, 28 January 2017 (UTC)

Now that SS036 "The Legend of X, Y, and Z" has been released in English...

...Is it fair to say we can add Zygarde to the trio?

In the episode, Alexa and Sycamore tell the story of Xerneas, Yveltal, and Zygarde, which are written about in a legend called the Chapter of the Stone-Eyed Maiden.

A "Y" symbol on the Chapter of the Stone-Eyed Maiden references Yveltal. An "X" symbol on the Chapter of the Stone-Eyed Maiden references Xerneas. A "Z" symbol on the Chapter of the Stone-Eyed Maiden references Zygarde, which appeared after Xerneas was angered.

After telling the story, Sycamore says, "I believe both Xerneas and Yveltal are incarnations of nature that take care of the land, that is their task and their purpose. And when the natural order is undone, Zygarde appears in order to balance it. These three powerful Pokemon preside over the neverending cycle of life."

I probably explained it poorly, but there you go... --Celadonkey 13:27, 28 January 2017 (UTC)

A few other people have been discussing it on other talk pages and I think it's pretty compelling. --Celadonkey 17:35, 29 January 2017 (UTC)

Re: Why did you remove the trivium I added about Ash's Original series outfit in the XY Series trivium?

Hi there, I asked on the XY series talk page and asked if I can add the trivium about Ash's original series outfit not being shown (including flashbacks). I've watched every single XY series episode and found Ash's original series outfit not shown at all in a single episode, not even including flashbacks. How come that trivium needed to be removed from the Trivia page in the XY series? I don't normally have any problems with anyone undoing my edits but I just don't understand why that part of the trivium needed to be removed and I was never trying to edit war. Can you please let me know why that part of the trivium I added needed to be removed even though it was true? Thank you. PokeAmour (talk) 01:26, 29 January 2017 (UTC)

Because it's insignificant. Ash's original outfit should not be expected to make an appearance.--ForceFire 04:50, 29 January 2017 (UTC)
Insignificant? What do you mean? I don't get it, it's appeared at least once in every other series (whether in flashbacks or not) before the XY series. PokeAmour (talk) 06:15, 29 January 2017 (UTC)
The second sentence of my response.--ForceFire 06:35, 29 January 2017 (UTC)

Lillie's Vulpix

Can someone please delete the Lillie's Vulpix page? The episode where she gets it hasn't been shown yet (whether it's in the next or not). I've already been preparing one anyway for when the episode comes up.-- --Handmaiden 101 (tAlk) 18:40, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

Nevermind, it was moved to the user space.-- --Handmaiden 101 (tAlk) 19:29, 2 February 2017 (UTC)
For future reference, the proper way to go about doing this is to add the {{delete}} template to the page in question. --Felthry (talk) 22:30, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

Welcome Template

Sorry! Was unaware of that. Cheers! -Uncleben85 (talk) 06:54, 5 February 2017 (UTC)


Hey ForceFire,what exactly counts as "trivia"? I point things out like how serene grace can only be obtained by Gen 5 pokemon as a non-hidden ability, or how some other small thing is trivia, but every time it tends to get deleted. PlatinumPokenut (talk) 04:12, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

User:Force Fire/Trivia Policy.--ForceFire 04:18, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

Move GIFs

Hey ForceFire, you're an admin or some other high rank, right? So do you think we should put GIFs of moves where the current images are? You know, so readers can see what it looks like in battle. PlatinumPokenut (talk) 23:59, 15 February 2017 (UTC)

Not ForceFire, but there are already animated pictures there. They're animated pngs. --Celadonkey 00:09, 16 February 2017 (UTC)
The images will be updated when we get to it, have patience. And your signature goes after your comment, not before it.--ForceFire 04:40, 16 February 2017 (UTC)

EP028 and Voltorb

Voltorb isn't a painting. It is a physical Voltorb that has been painted. It's the episode that James and Jessie have created a salon and are painting/putting makeup on Pokémon. - unsigned comment from JamesyWamesy (talkcontribs)

Ah, okay. Haven't seen the episode in a long time and was just going by your edit summary. My apologies.--ForceFire 06:08, 21 February 2017 (UTC)

Lycanroc image

Was thinking this image featuring both forms of Lycanroc could be used on the page for in the anime (talk) 13:18, 23 February 2017 (UTC)


Sorry about the Fletchinder trivia - I forgot that Crabominable had an I. --Celadonkey 16:52, 28 February 2017 (UTC)

No problem.--ForceFire 16:53, 28 February 2017 (UTC)


After reviewing your policies, I have a few questions.

  • Why is the section called "Trivia" if it is not intended to contain obscure, minor details? If the concern is that the section would become cluttered with information or otherwsie become more difficult to read, perhaps consider dividing the section as clearly on the page as you've divided it in your policy.
  • How is it possible for one person (or a small group of people) to remove information from a "trivia" section on the grounds that it "isn't interesting/notable"? Your policy acknowledges that different details are interesting to different people, so "notability" seems like a flimsy and ill-defined basis for considering what trivia is and is not allowed; this holds true in spite of your efforts to specify some parameters. Again, maybe "Trivia" is not an appropriate name for the section if this is how its content is determined.
  • Inconsistency in notability. How is my trivia on legendary stat distribution less notable than Suicune being the only legendary beast that doesn't have a unique Effort Value yield? Being slightly less notable than two other Pokemon doesn't seem very notable to me. Or is it simply a submission that has fallen below the radar despite EpicDeino's open invitation to remove it if it isn't notable (13 August 2016)?

Anyway, this is the part where I explain why I think my trivia complies with your policy (aside from failing to submit it to the discussion section first, which won't happen again now that I've read the could-be-more-prominently-displayed policy).

  • My trivia identify 2 stat combinations that are unique throughout the entire Pokedex and that are each applied exclusively to Legendary Pokemon across different gens (1-2 and 4-5). This makes it more notable than the fact that most sets of Legendaries do the same thing but only with their immediately-obvious counterparts from their own generation (it's also more notable than other forms of obviously-related Pokemon such as the Eeveelutions). The trivia is even more compelling in the case of gens 4-5, as the affected Pokemon are also all dual-typed Dragons that represent a fundamental force/trait/concept in the universe and all 5 of these dragons are featured on the cover of a main-series game. Altogether, I feel that this trivia is more closely related in nature to your "Flame Pokemon" example than to your understandable adherence to what makes a "unique/notable stat".
  • Would you find this trivia more appropriate if I structured it and the other relationships I described above in the same way as the Noibat/Zubat relationship?

As a side note, I didn't add this trivia indiscriminately simply because it's something I noticed. The same process that revealed this relationship also revealed that Gloom and Porygon have the exact same stats except for swapped HP/Attack (as but one example), but I felt those didn't strike the right convergence of interesting, not-immediately-obvious and logical-in-hindsight. Areku (talk) 20:11, 1 March 2017 (UTC)

(Not to start anything but personally I absolutely agree here and honestly - the exact Gloom/Porygon thing mentioned is what I would consider most Trivia worthy. Because it is an absolutely useless, absolutely obscure information unless you were looking for it and that's what a trivium should be. The Trivia category is definitely one I read most often here and facts like that are the reason I do it. Otherwise there's a lot of Trivia content that's not really interesting (the Suicune's EV yield is a great example) and there should be a better system for this. Also regarding the way the Trivia Policy is hidden, I can't even find it on your userpage.) KingisNitro (talk) 21:07, 1 March 2017 (UTC)
  • It's called the trivia section because it's what it is, a section for trivia. Not sure what you mean by splitting the trivia section up, if you're njot referring to the "origin"/"Name origin"/etc, I don't think it's necessary to split them up any further. And my trivia policy doesn't split up anything.
  • Notability is subjective. The policy is to boil down what is and isn't notable to get rid of any subjective opinions, i.e. a rule that everyone can agree on (like unique types being agreed as notable site wide). There are of course no wrong or right opinion, but anything on the notable or unnotable sections of that policy are generally things that are agreed to be notable site wide. Smaller things are just a case by case basis.
  • Your trivia was removed because it was a tie for a "normal" base stat and was too specific (I'll explain later when I get through the other part of this point). The Suicune trivia is not notable and should be removed, as one out of three is too small of a group to be notable. Simply put, the Suicune trivia wasn't notable and did not get removed because it was most likely overlooked.
  • The trivia you proposed was too specific, at least the way you worded it. Only ties for the highest' or lowest base stat total are notable, everything in between is not. We do this so not to clutter the trivia section with other ties for non highest/lowest base stat totals. And the part about their individual base stat being different is too specific, it does not matter that their individual base stats are different. It's too minor and widespread to note, as every other Pokémon with shared base stat total have different base stat values.
  • As for the legendaries having the same base stat total as their counterpart or dragon legendaries having the same base stat total because their mascot Pokémon is just too obvious. Counterparts are clearly going to have similar stats.
  • Category trivia is a different thing, it's not restricted to a set of things, like how there are 18 types, so it's restricted to that number. CAtegory is not restricted to a set number of words and they (Nintendo) could use a whole range of words. The Zubat/Noibat trivia is a comparison trivia, again different. Although the mention of them having similar base stat total with different base stat values should be removed as per my reasoning earlier.
  • I initially thought you meant the Porygon/Gloom thing was on their pages. But again, it's too minor, specific, and widespread. Many Pokémon with the same base stat total have different individual base stat.
  • @KingIsNitro, it's on my userpage in the infobox, under subpages.--ForceFire 05:35, 2 March 2017 (UTC)
  • Your policy very clearly divides trivia into 7 different categories. You even have a template at the bottom of the page that leads to separate hyperlinks describing each in greater detail. One of my proposals is less restrictive "notability" criteria for trivia entries, and if any given trivia section becomes too large or otherwise difficult to read, split it up according to these categories rather than deleting things you personally don't find "notable".
  • I understand that some measures must be taken to prevent utterly banal trivia from rendering the section unreadable, but I feel that a strictly literal interpretation of your current policy is too restrictive. Case in point: might as well delete Meganium's entire trivia section.
  • Some portions of your explanation convey a lack of understanding of my submission. I'm not saying it's notable that these Pokemon have the same base stat total, I'm saying they have the same individual stats just in a different order. That they would have the same total is one obvious consequence and is not the focus of the trivia.
  • I also think you are overestimating how common this type of relationship is. Currently, only 109 Pokemon have this type of relationship; just 48 after removing the very obvious cases where all Pokemon sharing a common stat spread are related through evolution (Eeveelutions, Gardevoir/Gallade etc) or are immediately adjacent in the Pokedex (the Pan/Simi monkeys, Legendary clusters made only from Pokemon of 1 gen etc). For comparison, 77 Pokemon have unique base stat totals. Of these remaining 48, the Gen 4-5 Box Dragons form the most noteworthy cluster, and many of the more-apparent ones (Meganium/Venusaur, Drampa/Turtonator etc) already contain this information in their trivia sections, and the relationship between Hoppip/Fomantis could give the latter its first trivia entry.
  • I contend that this type of relationship is more worthy of an entry in a Pokemon's trivia section than "it has the highest HP of a Steel type"; the latter can quickly be identified by any curious party by exploring List of Pokémon by base stats (Generation VII-present). What I'm describing is something that can't be revealed at a glance on such an already-noteworthy page.
  • I'm honestly quite baffled that your approach was to delete that relationship from the Zubat/Noibat connection; now it's just "these are two Pokemon that resemble the same animal and have a common ability". You made the trivia less notable than before. Should I add similar "trivia" for all of the bird-like Pokemon with Keen Eye?
  • You say that it's obvious that some counterparts would have stats in common. This is certainly true, but it only goes so far. Do you consider Mewtwo and Ho-Oh to be counterparts? Did you know that Giratina/Reshiram had the same stats before I brought it up? And if you find the latter unworthy because it's still "too obvious", this suggests that you feel Porygon/Gloom would be worthy because it's so random, but you reject that as well. Honestly, it sounds like you're contradicting yourself in an effort to have it both ways.
  • I'm going to be frank: Your current rigid approach to trivia entries feels like it flies in the face of what makes a trivia section interesting. One of the most interesting things about the Pokemon franchise is the complex interrelationships between Pokemon species, and your current system of "notability" actively restrains the exploration of such relationships. Your trivia policy feels decidedly anti-trivia and needs either significant revision or less draconian application. Areku (talk) 19:23, 2 March 2017 (UTC)
  • Oh, those aren't what you think they are. Those split up the type of trivia. So "Species" are trivia that go on the individual species page, "anime" are trivia that go on the anime page, so on so forth. The trivia section on of itself does not need to be split off, we have (very) large trivia sections (Pikachu comes to my head). The length of trivia sections is a non issue, it's the unnotable content within the trivia the are an issue.
  • Most of the notable or unnotable things on that page were gathered from the trivia and opinions of the time (which was... 2010, I believe), I looked around to see what trivia was considered notable and unnotable by looking at disussions, history revisions, and what trivia was consistently present among pages - hence "agreed upon site-wide". Notability is ever-changing as new opinions come up, which is why it's still in the userspace - it's something that's going to be updated constantly until staff and users alike can come to an agreeable conclusion. As for the Meganium trivia, many pages have trivia that would be unnotable, they're never changed or removed because no one has gotten around to doing so.
  • 48 is still quite a large number, and trying to specify specific grouping of Pokémon that are related in one way or another makes it too obvious. Again, notability is subjective and this is my opinion. Many Pokémon have similar stats but different individual values, 48 or 109 by your count, so it's nothing special and it doesn't mean much. It may be common, but it's too common, making it too obvious. Of the Pokémon that you've listed in the latter half of your argument, Turtonator/Drampa are the only one that should mention stat differences - only because it's not the point of the trivia. The point of their trivia is to explain how and why they can be considered counterparts. Meganium/Venusaur and Hoppip/Fomantis shouldn't have it as they're not counterparts.
  • "Highest HP of a Steel type" is basic, to the point, and not overtly specific. It is also a fact. Yes, one can see that by looking at another page, but that's one step too many when you can just go to the article of the Pokémon without having to surf through a list. Yes, the trivia you proposed is obscure, but it's too obscure and minor.
  • Eh, I'm okay with it being removed, but decided to keep it to see if someone else thought it had become unnotable.
  • Mewtwo/Ho-oh and Giratina/Reshiram are legendaries, not counterparts. It's obvious that a specific grouping of Pokémon are going to have similar stats. Gloom/Porygon are just two random Pokémon that have similar stats and fall into the "many other Pokémon have similar stats" rule.
  • Sometimes, these complex relationships are just too obvious too identify because the parties of this complex relationship are part of a specific grouping, and as I've said before, it's obvious that legendaries are going to have similar stats.
  • As I mentioned earlier, the trivia policy is ever changing, it's going to be updated constantly until users and staff can come to an agreeable conclusion. So if you have a proposal for trivia notability, you can always bring it up and the staff will make a decision. Stat trivia have been discussed before, back in 2012, and I believe that the decision to make clear cut stat trivia (i.e. highest/lowest stat) the only thing notable. I may have to go back and look, or revisit stat trivia as a whole, as that decision was made five years ago and opinions can change.--ForceFire 05:52, 3 March 2017 (UTC)


Thanks for the advice; I couldn't find any rules or guidelines on hyperlinks, so I was stumped on what to link and what not to link.--RedHailfire (talk) 16:26, 2 March 2017 (UTC)

More Cast lists

Received more cast lists from Lisa Ortiz for Sun and Moon, sent you screenshots from the email, do I have approval--BigDocFan (talk) 13:29, 13 March 2017 (UTC)

Looks to me like they are the cast lists for SM002 and SM003.--BigDocFan (talk) 13:38, 13 March 2017 (UTC)
Those are fine by me. Feel free to add them in.--ForceFire 15:36, 13 March 2017 (UTC)

Is April Fools Day vandalism okay here?

Some wikis like ssbwiki allow vandalism on April 1st. What about this site? - unsigned comment from Unowninator (talkcontribs)

By normal users? No. The staff usually plan an April Fools prank, but we don't allow normal users to do so.--ForceFire 04:16, 17 March 2017 (UTC)
Damn. Okay well, thanks for answering. Unowninator (talk) 04:23, 17 March 2017 (UTC)

Meyer's Blaziken

Just wondering if it was about time that Meyer's Blaziken received a page of its own because it was featured a lot--BigDocFan (talk) 16:27, 17 March 2017 (UTC)

Apologies for the late reply. I'll bring it up with the other staff members to see what they think of it.--ForceFire 04:05, 19 March 2017 (UTC)

Lillie Pokemon Template

Can the template for Lillie's Pokemon be made now? She has two Pokemon (Shiron and Nebby) that meet the requirement you wanted.--Rahl (talk) 23:22, 24 March 2017 (UTC)

Could you please get back to me on this?--Rahl (talk) 14:46, 1 April 2017 (UTC)
I'll bring it up with the other staff member for consideration.--ForceFire 03:35, 7 April 2017 (UTC)

Poké Ride on anime trainer templates

Apparently you've made the decsion that ride Pokemon should not go on the Ash's Pokémon template, which is fine; mI'm not going to argue that either way. However I'd like to point out that the templates for Mallow, Kiawe and the other Sun and Moon characters have Poké Ride Pokémon on their templates. Obviously, it has to be one way or the other so I'm here asking for a definative answer. Diamond Lanturn CodeName: 05308 13:33, 26 March 2017 (UTC)

This is something we're discussing, in tandem with other things. I'll give them a nudge about where we stand on this.--ForceFire 03:35, 7 April 2017 (UTC)

The 3rd Sun & Moon TCG Expansion

If it's okay with you, I have made a page about To Have Seen The Battle Rainbow/Darkness That Consumes Light. There was a picture with the card packs, with one featuring Ho-Oh, the other featuring Necrozma. It also shows the release date for its debut in Japan, along with the number 150. I'm not sure if that's the total amount of the cards in the set.

Also, I saw said picture online.Hamfart 17:12, 27 March 2017 (UTC)

FWIW, Hamfart, you would probably be better served by discussing TCG-related things with Maverick Nate, as he's our Head of TCG and therefore has final say on these kinds of things. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 17:15, 27 March 2017 (UTC)

Quick question

Just curious, do you happen to have a copy of the emails I sent you with screenshots of the cast for M18 and XY092?--BigDocFan (talk) 16:05, 6 April 2017 (UTC)

Yes, I still have them. Do you need them?--ForceFire 03:35, 7 April 2017 (UTC)
I do, Would you mind sending them to me, having lost the email I received them with, I like to keep copies--BigDocFan (talk) 06:02, 7 April 2017 (UTC)
It appears I'm unable to send you an email. Are you aware of the public bulbagarden discord, btw? I'm on there most of the time and you can send me a private message there if you want a quicker response.--ForceFire 07:43, 7 April 2017 (UTC)
Any chance of you PMing it to me through the forums here on Bulbapedia?--BigDocFan (talk) 14:49, 7 April 2017 (UTC)
If you jave an account on the forums, I can do that as well.--ForceFire 14:50, 7 April 2017 (UTC)
For some reason I am unable to start a conversation with you, I have the same account name on the forums as I do on here--BigDocFan (talk) 14:54, 7 April 2017 (UTC)
I've sent it.--ForceFire 15:05, 7 April 2017 (UTC)
Thanks, hope to receive more cast lists soon--BigDocFan (talk) 15:09, 7 April 2017 (UTC)


Why is it unneeded?Horton Hears a murder (talk) 14:50, 7 April 2017 (UTC)


It not ironic tht corsla ca div as div is a mov an pokemon ca div without knwin th mve in othr meda.Horton Hears a murder (talk) 14:53, 7 April 2017 (UTC)


Wht similar is constelTION TO TAUROS?Horton Hears a murder (talk) 15:08, 7 April 2017 (UTC)

Edit warring

Pls stp reverting tht and "Do not misrepresent rumors, misconceptions or opinions as fact"Horton Hears a murder (talk) 15:14, 7 April 2017 (UTC)

Spritebox/7 should be made by now.

I'm just throwing it out there, since sprites like Spr 7s 103A.png and Spr 7s 745.png have been uploaded. When will it be made?--Hamfart 13:57, 10 April 2017 (UTC)

I second this - every sprite for every Pokémon and form, back and front, regular and shiny, has been uploaded (I think that's more than even Gen VI can say, actually), and several users have made their own version of Spritebox/7 templates. --Celadonkey 15:32, 10 April 2017 (UTC)
I once made one, but ForceFire deleted it, due to me not being a member of the Bulbapedia Staff.--Hamfart 20:47, 10 April 2017 (UTC)
That reminds me. Should I make one for Zygarde, if it's okay?--Hamfart 15:39, 13 April 2017 (UTC)
Hamfart, Celadonkey, the sprite boxes will be made when it gets made, have patience.--ForceFire 03:32, 14 April 2017 (UTC)
Sorry, but I hesitated on Minior's page. I couldn't take it!--Hamfart 16:31, 24 April 2017 (UTC)
If you are impatient and "can't handle it", go find something else to do while the staff gets the template up. Don't be brash and just make the changes. If I see you being impatient again, I won't be so lenient.--ForceFire 02:23, 25 April 2017 (UTC)


Got a screenshot from First Catch in Alola, Ketchum-style! of Who's that Pokemon [url=][img]WTP_SM004.png[/img][/url]--BigDocFan (talk) 09:34, 14 April 2017 (UTC)

Done.--ForceFire 14:53, 14 April 2017 (UTC)
Thanks, with the UK getting 4 new episodes next week, 3 before Canada I may screenshot from Iplayer and post it here for you to add--BigDocFan (talk) 15:02, 14 April 2017 (UTC)

Regarding Gladion's page

About the edit I have made, you said that just because he was seen holding a Cleffa doesn't mean it is his. However on Lillie's page, it is seen that she was holding a Lillipup as well as the description saying that is may not even be hers. To maintain consistency should Lillie's page be modified or should the description for Gladion be re-added under "Status Unknown"? Nikuriku (talk) 02:18, 15 April 2017 (UTC)

It should be removed from Lillie's page as well.--ForceFire 04:52, 15 April 2017 (UTC)

I'd like to upload a couple of images.

Hey there! I'm adding a bunch of so far undocumented information to the Character encoding in Generation III page, and there are a few characters that can't be represented with Unicode. I figured I'd upload the characters (15 tiny ~8x16 PNGs) to the Archives, as has already been done for a few, but as it turns out I can't upload images since I'm not auto-confirmed on the archives. Seeing as I'm auto-confirmed here, though, is there perhaps a way to arrange so I can upload them and add them to the article? Cheers. LpSamuelm (talk) 16:51, 15 April 2017 (UTC)

Images for Bulbapedia

Screenshots several images from M19 for possible use on Bulbapedia, any chance you could convert them please? - unsigned comment from BigDocFan (talkcontribs)

Where would these images be used, first of all.--ForceFire 11:54, 17 April 2017 (UTC)
Was thinking they could be used in Nebel Plateau to replace the Espurr, Amaura, Kirlia, Mincinno and Wormadam as they use the customary image.--BigDocFan (talk) 12:02, 17 April 2017 (UTC)
Ah, I see. The images are pretty small, is there a way you can make them bigger (preferably the same size as the any other anime picture).--ForceFire 12:13, 17 April 2017 (UTC)
No wait, never mind.--ForceFire 12:15, 17 April 2017 (UTC)
Got a screenshot of WTP for SS036 here, [url=][img]SS037_WTP.png[/img][/url]--BigDocFan (talk) 20:05, 17 April 2017 (UTC)

Who's That Pokemon Screenshots

With the UK getting episodes before Canada, thought I would post screenshots of Who's that Pokemon here for you (talk) 08:21, 19 April 2017 (UTC)

Sm025 moves

So explain to me why the totem Pokemon doesn't have Bite or Hyper Beam? I can see that you're following the "no one said anything despite it being obvious so we are just going to ignore it" logic but you have a page that even says Hyper Beam is not to be questioned. Do the rules just not exist for admins? We even saw Bite not even 5 episodes ago and it worked just the same as this time. Isn't the wiki to add and contribute information, not shun it because its not spoon feed to us?--Pikablu (talk) 12:24, 6 May 2017 (UTC)

Bite could've been Crunch... it's not that hard. The "Hyper Beam" didn't look like Hyper Beam, yellow-ish beam rather than a red or orange beam, it could've been any other beam moves. Also, we send messages to the talk pages of the users that added the information, not on the talk page of the article in dispute. Sending the message directly to the user is more effective, even if there's a good chance that they're not going to read it.--ForceFire 12:33, 6 May 2017 (UTC)

So we really aren't going to say it's Hyper Beam because the move was a little lighter than you want it? This site is going to end up missing so much information because of views like this.--Pikablu (talk) 13:50, 6 May 2017 (UTC)

It does not match the previous animation, so no. Unless Hyper Beam gets called out in a future episode and it shares that exact animation and color, we'll assume Hyper Beam's animation has the same as the previous series.--ForceFire 14:11, 6 May 2017 (UTC)

Your reverted edit on my edit to necrozma's trivia

I think your given reason is invalid, as Necrozma is stated to resemble the Ultra Beasts and appears to have some kind of relationship with them. Necrozma also appears to have some kind of relationship with the Cosmog line, and furthermore, this common trait cannot be a simple coincidence, as there are not that many prime numbers and most Pokemon have base stats that are not prime, with many (particularly Pokemon with BSTs of 600 and 680) having only base stats in multiples of 5, and most Pokemon learning level-up moves at non-prime levels (Cosmog and Cosmoem even evolve at prime number levels, so that line is definitely associated with prime numbers). Why is a non-coincidental common trait with a group of Pokemon it resembles and is somehow related to not notable? (it's also an interesting trait) PartHunter (talk) 15:10, 7 May 2017 (UTC)

It's not a matter of whether they share the trait or why (which is speculation), it's a matter of different standards of notability on group pages and species pages. The trivium exists on the Ultra Beast page because it is describing a trait that the whole group shares (and therefore, the standard of not unique=not notable does not apply, because notability on the group page isn't affected by whether other Pokemon outside the group also share the trait). On individual species pages, the standard of not unique=not notable does apply, so it does not belong on Necrozma, Solgaleo, or wherever else you want to put it. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 17:27, 7 May 2017 (UTC)
FYI, Force Fire (and PartHunter), we've had this discussion with Crystal Talian (and another at Solgaleo) before. (I'll give Force Fire some time to respond before possibly reacting/replying to what Pumpkinking said.) Nescientist (talk) 18:38, 7 May 2017 (UTC)
Exactly what Pumpkinking said. Whether Necrozma and the cosmos are Ultra Beast is entirely speculation. It's only implied/stated, not confirmed 100% that they are Ultra Beast, so as far as we're concerned, the five are not Ultra Beast. I can easily see this being a case of Zygarde/Kyurem/Giratina, all the hints are there, but we want the game/anime/whatever to actually confirm it. I know it sounds like we want the info to be spoon fed to us, but it's better to be safe than sorry.--ForceFire 04:18, 8 May 2017 (UTC)
I feel like I'm investing too much here, but I honestly believe you're missing the fundamental point, Force Fire (and Pumpkinking, and maybe PartHunter as well?), and that you're arguing different things. Maybe, let me create an analogeous problem, then you might unterstand my concern:
Different people are saying: "This woman looks a lot like a Kardashian", and some of them provide arguments. (Just imagine we believe being Kardashian, or looking like them, is notable.) As I said, I believe you're arguing different things: you're not saying "I don't think so/I don't see it", but you're instead saying "There's no confirmation she's a Kardashian", "She's not part of a group", or even "I agree, but we're not sure she's a Kardashian". My point is: she looks like a Kardashian either way (this), and I think that's notable. Nescientist (talk) 19:33, 9 May 2017 (UTC)

(resetting indent)Eh, I have a lot of counterarguments that I'm not even sure are worth bringing up, so let me just back up to before the UBs got involved and ask one thing: is this prime-number thing notable in and of itself? I don't think it is. Bringing the UBs into the debate turns it into an argument over what constitutes proof that they look enough like UBs, but does it even matter whether they look like them at all? To my knowledge, we don't note on any other Pokemon or group pages when they learn moves at a certain pattern of levels, like every 5th level or alternating between every 7th and 11th levels. What makes prime numbers notable when those aren't? Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 20:09, 9 May 2017 (UTC)

Yes... Prime numbers are notable. They're prime numbers. They have their own name... They are practically special by definition.
Every 5 or 7 or 11 levels are easy patterns and don't deserve a name or anything. They don't deserve noting. If some group followed the Fibonacci sequence, that'd be notable too. These things take some particular effort, as opposed to plug-and-play with easy concepts and random variables. Tiddlywinks (talk) 22:27, 9 May 2017 (UTC)
Force Fire (or any staff), could you please take action regarding Pumpkinking's content removal without discussion/mid-discussion, which is blatantly (and repeatedly) disregarding other opinion? Thanks.
Regarding what you wrote here, Pumpkingking: My opinion hasn't changed, I think it's notable. Nescientist (talk) 19:07, 10 May 2017 (UTC)
If you want to restore it, restore what was originally there. I won't dispute that. The bad version that someone added later was... just blatantly bad, I don't think anyone can argue with that, and I have no qualms about removing it. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 19:11, 10 May 2017 (UTC)
As Pumpkinking has just restored the content in question, you may refrain from taking action.
Pumpkinking, I would be much at ease if I knew that you would refrain from such behavior in the future, and from pretending it was covered by the be bold principle. Thanks for restoring it, anyway. Nescientist (talk) 19:52, 10 May 2017 (UTC)
I don't see what you have such a big problem with, and I find your tone a bit patronizing. That is what the be bold principle is: that it's better to act and potentially be reverted than to get bogged down in a bunch of bureaucratic talk pages. (That is, unless the action is exclusive to the staff, like page moves and terminology changes.) Had someone just reverted me in the first place instead of writing a new, badly-written version, I would have had no objection. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 20:09, 10 May 2017 (UTC)
The prime number trivia is notable as it is shared by a very specific set of Pokémon rather than just a bunch of random Pokémon. That's why it's on the Ultra Beast page.
Nescientist, you can't say something is an Ultra Beast because it looks... well, what is an Ultra meant to look like specifically? The current Ultra Beast look like standard Pokémon in my opinion. I see where you're going with the analogy... but it's weak, since the monstrous beings looks like all the other monstrous beings. Again, we want Game Freak to say whether Necrozma and the cosmos are Ultra Beasts, just like how they confirmed that the Guardian Deities are legendary.--ForceFire 05:49, 11 May 2017 (UTC)
I wasn't referring to the physical appearance of (potential) Ultra Beasts at all. I was just referring to how they share prime numbers.
As another illustration: Just imagine Kangaskhan and Stunfisk learn their moves at Fibonacci sequence levels. I believe that alone might be trivia-worthy, even though they're clearly not a single Pokémon and unrelated in virtually any other way. Because it's interesting, obviously intended (for whatever reason), easy to miss.
And now imagine it wasn't Kangaskhan and Stunfisk, but the Machop and Abra lines. I believe then, it is more trivia-worthy, because they are related, somehow. Nevertheless, it certainly wouldn't prove they're official counterparts.
To avoid misunderstanding: I do not want to convince you that all those Pokémon definitely are Ultra Beasts (because I do not know either). I believe the wording PartHunter introduced at Necrozma is completely innocuous. People can draw their own conclusions (if they're presented what is easy to miss).
(And Pumpkinking, I have zero interest to sound patronizing, even less directed at you. I also don't have "such a big problem", and I do encourage you to be bold. However, you removed it despite being very well aware others argued for the opposite, without discussion; and that's what I didn't like at all.) Nescientist (talk) 15:54, 11 May 2017 (UTC)

Regarding the removal of my trivia edit

I'm aware that the act of flying doesn't count as the HM move but in EP131, Ash tells his Charizard to use its "Fly attack" (which it never used due to circumstances) as well as the Ash's Charizard page listing Fly as one of it's official moves. Wouldn't that technically make Charizard the first of Ash's Pokemon to KNOW an HM move which I stated before? I also did specify that it KNEW the move but just simply didn't USE it which still makes Ash's Grotle the first of his Pokemon to use an HM move. - unsigned comment from Nikuriku (talkcontribs)

There's a possibility that Charizard doesn't actually know the move Fly. As ridiculous as it sounds, you have to consider that possibility.--ForceFire 03:50, 12 May 2017 (UTC)

Electabuzz/Magmar Moveset Thingy

I was trying to clarify the bit of Electabuzz trivia about learning moves at the same level as Magmar since Gen V, with Fire/Thunder Punch as an example. You then removed the "for example" part... It's just that now, to me anyway, it's saying that the extent of their "similar movesets" is the fact they both learn elemental punches... at some point... which is hardly "similar movesets." I wanted to convey the fact that, at every level one of them learns a move, the other also learns a move (usually a similar one: punches at 29, Discharge/Lava Plume at 36, both of which are moves that damage allies as well as opponents in multi battles, then a status move at 42...). I'd like some discussion before I just go back and potentially start an edit war. Masternachos (talk) 16:55, 11 May 2017 (UTC)

I've tried to create a compromise. I agree with Force Fire that the example was unnecessary, but you're right that his edit was confusing. I've changed it to just say they often learn similar moves at the same level, which I think most readers will be able to understand without an example. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 17:20, 11 May 2017 (UTC)
Looks good to me. Thanks! Masternachos (talk) 21:24, 11 May 2017 (UTC)
You said they learned the moves at different level between games and used one of the levels from one of the games as an example, which I thought was a bit redundant since "learns similar moves at similar levels" was fine enough as it is. I didn't remove the moves as I didn't think about that, but I don't mind its removal as well.--ForceFire 03:50, 12 May 2017 (UTC)


Hi, I was wondering if Serena can be listed as a Coordinator in her profile? We haven't seen her actually compete in Contests, but she was shown arriving in the Hoenn region. Does it still count?-- --Handmaiden 101 (tAlk) 16:55, 18 May 2017 (UTC)

No. Until we actually see her compete in contests, she is not a coordinator, regardless of it being the whole point she's in Hoenn.--ForceFire 03:32, 19 May 2017 (UTC)
That's total BS. We did not see her changing her mind about competing in Contests. She definitely went to Hoenn to compete in them. GrammarFreak01 (talk) 05:45, 19 May 2017 (UTC)

I have to apologize for my participation in this edit war. At first I was just trying to return things to the staff-approved version, then it occurred to me that GrammarFreak would be banned for more time for each revert and from then on I was half-trying to provoke them. But now that it's well past a dozen back-and-forths, I'm looking at the history tab and realizing that was a bad decision. I have to apologize for my lapse in judgment. I made a mistake in participating. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 06:02, 19 May 2017 (UTC)

Pumpkinking, for my part, I have seen you in general being helpful around the Wiki and here trying to aid in enforcing the decision of a senior administrator. I would be willing to let that slide for you thus for reasons I won't get into here.
GrammarFreak01, you need to understand something. We have not seen Serena since her arrival in Hoenn. While it's very likely she will appear in contests there, we have not seen anything confirming it, and until we do, we cannot say what she's up to. It's like when you go to court to sue someone for damages; you have to prove, in some way, that you have suffered such that damages ought to be awarded to you. This could be something like not receiving rent for an agreement with a rentor for your place, or something simpler like a car accident where the other party is at fault for damages to your vehicle. With no evidence of damages, you get no reward. Similarly here, with no proof that Serena has entered contests, she is not considered a coordinator. If there is later a side episode (as sometimes happens with retired cnaracters from the main anime) where she's seen competing, or if she appears in the main series now on an episode (this has happened in Sinnoh and Unova, in fact), then we may get some answer to this. Until then, she is not a coordinator in our eyes. Force Fire is absolutely correct in his choice here. CycloneGU (talk) 06:17, 19 May 2017 (UTC)
That is absolute nonsense! Why would Serena give up on being a Coordinator when she was clearly devoted to following Palermo's advice and going to Hoenn to compete in them?! What other reason would she have in going to Hoenn?! GrammarFreak01 (talk) 06:21, 19 May 2017 (UTC)
You're thinking too much into it GrammarFreak. Yes, she went to Hoenn to compete in contests. But that doesn't mean she's actually competing in contests at this moment. If a friend of mine said he was going to the US to meet the president and sends me a picture of him at JFK airport, I'll believe he's in the US but not that he has met the president, because he hasn't shown proof that he has met the president. Same here, until the anime shows Serena competing in contests, she is not a coordinator and is just in Hoenn.--ForceFire 09:48, 19 May 2017 (UTC)


Why was that user blocked and what does "Your shoe's untied mean"? - unsigned comment from Tor (talkcontribs)

I think it's a joke reason. (Not sure why they do it though) Unowninator?! (talk) 15:30, 19 May 2017 (UTC)
Ultradeadpool was most likely a troll/vandal.--ForceFire 15:38, 19 May 2017 (UTC)


Why did you vandalise the Totem Pokemon page by deleting a known move? Playerking95 (talk) 08:57, 20 May 2017 (UTC)

Why are you assuming moves by basing it off other Pokémon with known moves? You know well enough not to assume. Just because it looked similar to Gumshoos using Bite, doesn't mean that it is Bite. It could've been any of the other biting moves.--ForceFire 08:58, 20 May 2017 (UTC)
Because an admin said that if it at least looks similar to a move than we can say it is that move? By that logic, we didn't know Kiawe's Turtonator used Flamethrower till SM015 or that Yungoos used Bite, because it's name wasn't stated. Why can Yungoos and Gumshoos be listed and Raticate can't be, even though they look EXACTLY the same? That doesn't make any sense. Playerking95 (talk) 09:12, 20 May 2017 (UTC)
Also, you do know I'm talking about the Yungoos from SM009 and not SM001, right? I'm talking about when it made that white teeth-shaped aura appear, like how Rockruff used it in SM023 on James's Mareanie and how Raticate used in SM025. Playerking95 (talk) 09:18, 20 May 2017 (UTC)
If the move has a unique animation, then yes we can assume moves. Bite does not have a unique animation. Those are separate instances. Just because one Pokémon used a move that was called out, it doesn't count for all of them. It's a case by case thing. "Oh, but why would it be separate moves if they all used the same animation?" Because the writers and animators can just do that. We can't guess what they're going to do, they might come up with one animation for Stone Edge for one episode and change the animation in the next episode. We cannot assume. We cannot guess. Doing so is prone for error.--ForceFire 09:26, 20 May 2017 (UTC)
How is a Pokemon creating an aura like set of teeth in the air not unique and if it's case by case basis, why is Gumshoos listed, since it wasn't called out in SM009? Playerking95 (talk) 09:30, 20 May 2017 (UTC)
Because it could've been any of the other biting moves (Crunch, Super Fang, Hyper Fang, etc.. exists you know).--ForceFire 09:36, 20 May 2017 (UTC)
Uh, yeah. I'm aware, you don't have to be condescending and it still doesn't explain why Gumshoos is listed as having used that. Playerking95 (talk) 09:42, 20 May 2017 (UTC)
Gumshoos and Yungoos WERE confirmed to use Bite by Officer Jenny. I don't understand you; you are the whole reason this 'don't assume the move' thing ever came to be. Why is Force Fire having to explain this to you when you were the one who brought it to attention in the first place. It's esspecually odd because this case demonstrates you were right more than any other case you've argued about. Diamond Lanturn CodeName: 05308 09:47, 20 May 2017 (UTC)
Oh, so Jenny called it out, been a while since I've watched the episode. Which begs the question, have you seen the episode Playerking, because surely if you were that adamant you would've went back and checked to see it it was called out.--ForceFire 09:49, 20 May 2017 (UTC)
So I've re-watched the episode in both English in Japanese (in the Japanese case, I tried to hear the Japanese name for Bite), and Jenny didn't say that Gumshoos and Yungoos used Bite in neither dub. Note that I skipped scenes and only watched scenes that had Jenny in them.--ForceFire 10:02, 20 May 2017 (UTC)
This was confirmed in the extra Poképroblem scene where Jenny coninved Gumshoos to join her, I believe. Diamond Lanturn CodeName: 05308 10:09, 20 May 2017 (UTC)
@05308: Um, no, I'm not the reason any for this don't assume thing, I'm just following the rules of the website, which I've said time and time again, so please learn to read what I've posted carefully and no, Jenny did not call out Bite. Kamitsuku was never called out by her and I don't know why you're saying she is and yes @ForceFire, I did watch the episode. I wouldn't be saying this if I didn't. So either Gumshoos should be removed from having used Bite or Raticate should be added. There shouldn't be any room for double standards. Edit: And no, it wasn't confirmed in the Poke Problem. Jenny. Never. Said. Kamitsuku. She said Maeba no Surudoi.Playerking95 (talk) 10:18, 20 May 2017 (UTC)
She didn't say it in the PokéProblem as well.--ForceFire 10:21, 20 May 2017 (UTC)

@Force Fire, it was my understanding that she said something like 'I was really impressed by your Bite' but I do not read or speak Japanesse nor was it I who originally added Bite to Gumshoos's page. I'm also not in any way in charge so if you've found that we cannot confirm the move was Bite- you know what you must do.

@PlayerKing, I knew I would regret even getting involved. I do not speak Japanesse, I don't know what they are saying. I did not add Bite to the page and I am only relaying the reason given by whoever it was that confirmed Bite. As you'd expect, there was dispute at the time of that episode and I thought it had been resolved when somone confirmed Jenny mentioned Bite. I do not decide these things and honestly, I don't care anymore because the amount of times I've come to blows with you specfically over this issue resembles quite a distastful relationship for two people who have no idea where the other lives, how old they are and even if they are a boy or a girl.

Though I would remind you that you DID start all this back around the time of XY071 regarding a Pangoro's Slash attack (Or whatever scratching move it could have been.) Since then, and let me stress that this has been going on for years, myself and a handful of other users have clashed with you ovcer the same issue. Only since then have Pokémon used moves in the anime and we've left them completely undocumented. Undocumented when litterally nobody else ever disputed that that Pangoro used Slash. I tried making a page so that these 'unidentifiable' moves could be at least listed somwhere; User:05308/Unidentifiable Moves in the Anime, but you've never been intrested in solving the problem, just shouting about them. Now search the pages for Bite, Slash, Tackle etc, there are litterally hundreds of moves (before XY071) that were never explicitly confirmed but are documented anyway because people don't care as much about a Thunderbolt possibly being a Thundershock as they do when neither is listed. Diamond Lanturn CodeName: 05308 10:56, 20 May 2017 (UTC)