Talk:Friend Safari: Difference between revisions

Latest revision as of 00:58, 10 May 2018

Page Creation

Will somebody that can make pages actually start this so we can edit it or give me permission to? The friend safari is actually a very fascinating place that needs to be covered! ViperByte (talk) 17:47, 25 October 2013 (UTC)

Didn't even see this message until I went and did it..... Problem solved. Schiffy (Speak to me|What I've done) 20:03, 25 October 2013 (UTC)

Pokémon not obtainable anywhere but the Friend Safari

When adding locations to Pokémon articles, what do we do about these kinds of Pokémon? For example, I have X where Pupitar is unavailable. I caught one in the Friend Safari. Do we put that it's available in both games via Friend Safari? Also, a friend of mine got a Charmeleon from the Friend Safari. Do we list that as a location too? The thing is, everyone gets different Pokémon so that's where I'm not sure. ☆The Solar Dragon☆ 20:11, 25 October 2013 (UTC)

I'm going to answer with my own opinion using both examples you've given.

For Pupitar, I would say for both X and Y have "Friend Safari" and "Evolve Larvitar" as options, and for Y only, have the locations it can appear in naturally (Route 18 and Terminus Cave, I believe) in addition.
For Charmeleon, I would say to have "Evolve Charmander" and "Friend Safari" for both games, and leave it at that, since those are the only two ways in either game that it can be obtained.

Anyway, this is just one opinion, but I would say to only ever have "Trade" as an option if there isn't another way to obtain it (besides Evolution), for example, this. Schiffy (Speak to me|What I've done) 20:16, 25 October 2013 (UTC)

IMHO, I don't think we should list the Friend Safari as a 'game location' for any species, pretty much ever. My reasoning for this is:

Friend Safari is not like previous Safari Zones with a fixed selection of wild Pokémon that you can catch all of; it is not like Pokéwalker or Pokémon Dream World of previous games either. Because what you can catch depends on who is registered in your 3DS Friend List (requiring personal exchange of Friend Codes), we can never guarantee that a specific Pokemon will be available in a specific player's game.
While we obviously do not have a full list, so far almost any non-legendary Pokémon (including wild starter Pokémon) can be caught in the Friend Safari with the correct friends registered. So for Pokemon that are more likely to be acquired via evolution (e.g. Fletchinder), mentioning Friend Safari is about as notable as mentioning that you can acquire a Pokemon from the GTS.

--Stratelier 20:02, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

Given that the amount of Pokémon unavailable in X & Y is over 100 and given the fact that many Pokémon in X & Y cannot be caught there, I think it's relevant to mention it where applicable. We list Regirock, Regice and Registeel being catchable in Platinum despite needing an event Pokémon that can no longer be acquired. Besides, listing the location of all these Pokémon as Trade would imply that they can't be caught in Gen VI at all to at least some people. - Blazios _talk 22:01, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

I agree with Blazios, with the added stipulation that I think we should treat it like the Dream World in Gen 5: mention it only if the Pokemon is not otherwise available in-game. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 22:08, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

We mentioned every single occurrence of a Pokémon appearing in the Dream World in Gen V and continue to list them even though they're gone forever, I don't see why this should be any different. I do think the template could use a slight tweaking for it, especially for Pokémon that are version exclusive outside the Friend Safari but available in both versions otherwise. Omitting the information from articles completely for Pokémon that are otherwise obtainable would imply that the Pokémon can't be found in Gen VI with its Hidden Ability (not counting Pokémon found in Hordes and their relatives, naturally). - Blazios _talk 18:36, 16 November 2013 (UTC)

Ah; I was mistaken on how we treated the Dream World, then. (Did we used to do it the way I said, and then switched to having a separate row for it? I'm not sure how else I could've gotten confused about that...) In that case, why not follow the Dream World/Pal Park's example and make a separate row in the template for the Friend Safari? That's the easiest and most reader-friendly way I can think to incorporate the version exclusivity question you mentioned and to prevent clutter for Pokemon that appear both in FS and in-game. Then, in later versions, if the Friend Safari availability is the same, we can treat it as we currently do the Dream World and Pal Park; and if it's different, we can rename the row "Friend Safari^XY" and add a row for the other version(s). Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 18:46, 16 November 2013 (UTC)

I suppose it would be possible to have it under a separate header like the Dream World and then list the Safari type in the location? - Blazios _talk 20:34, 16 November 2013 (UTC)

(reset)

I'm going to repeat what I wrote at Force Fire's talk page.

My suggestion is that any Pokémon catchable in a Friend Safari is notated as such, perhaps with a note stating that the Pokémon in each friend's Safari is random and is based on friend code. Thus, all 216 Pokémon (guessing there are 12 of each of the 18 types, some may be fewer) would be listed as Friend Safari with a note explaining the circumstances, and that listing is identical for all 216.

The reason I take this stance is because all Pokémon CAN be found there. We should be listing where Pokémon CAN potentially be found, not excluding entries because they must be found through a friend with the correct Safari to find it in. USers who have no friends (sad as that sounds, it does happen with younger players quite often since they're not as wired to the Internet and have very few fellow players to play with) will only find the three in their own Safaris. CycloneGU (talk) 04:27, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

I'm all for this suggestion. As I've said before, I think it would be incredibly lax of the wiki that aims for comprehensive articles on Pokémon games to blatantly disregard such a large feature of X & Y on so many articles. - Blazios _talk 04:41, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

I was under the impression* that the Friend Safari only had a selection of Pokemon, and not "almost any non-legendary"...But still, I would consider listing Friend Safari locations in a similar manner as the Dream World is currently listed to be a better solution than not listing the Friend Safari as a possible location at all. If I may have to do whatever amount of work, that's fine; just don't make me think that there's absolutely no way to get a Pokemon in Gen VI when I might be able to get it in the Friend Safari. If I know it's available in the Friend Safari, then I can decide whether I want to bother with that; but if you won't tell me, I can't even begin to make that decision. (And I have this thing about wanting to get as much as possible within whatever Generation I'm playing. So I definitely want to know.)

And regarding if the Friend Safari changes in a Gen VI game after X/Y, it might be simpler to just handle it like a version exclusive Pokemon (like Gothita) and just say it's only in the Friend Safari in X/Y or only in Z (or whatever). Tiddlywinks (talk) 05:31, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

Actually, it occurs to me that the "problem" of variable Pokemon in the Friend Safari is very analogous to the situation with White Forest. Certainly the Friend Safari has more possible Pokemon, but the fact is that you also can't "guarantee" that any player will actually have a Pokemon listed as being in "White Forest" in their game. You have to do some work. Just like for the Friend Safari. Yet White Forest locations are listed. So too should Friend Safari locations be (in some manner, at least). Tiddlywinks (talk) 06:03, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

(resetting indent) Gonna respond to a few people at once here, so bear with me.
As far as the initial issue goes, I've already given my opinion, and it's been expanded on plenty. There should certainly be something noted on the species pages, and this may be a whole lot easier once we learn more about what can show up.
To Cyclone: Simple issue, but as far as I'm aware, you cannot access your own Friend Safari, only that of a person registered as your friend. So people with no friends are, for lack of a better term, SOL in that regard.
To Tiddlywinks: As you can see, this list is still a work in progress. It seems, so far, we only have a fraction of what is available. What we do know is that it's based off of the friend code. This goes for type and the three Pokémon that are available. So if, for example, both me and say Cyclone were to resister you in our systems, we would both have access to the same type Safari with the same three Pokémon. At the current moment, that's really all we know. We haven't really been given evidence to say what can't show up. Yet, at the moment, it seems Legends are out, and starters from Gen II-V are not showing up. As far as finding out the remaining details, I did start a thread a while back trying to solve this mystery, but no one has given any response yet. Schiffy (Speak to me|What I've done) 14:55, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

Having looked around for a while, the list of Pokémon available is pretty much complete (I've seen people claim the existence of Lapras in the Water type Safari, though I can't confirm it myself. That's the single one I've seen that's missing from the list here). Serebii claims that each Pokémon is set to a specific spot on the Safari, meaning that some are unobtainable until the other person beats the Elite Four (we can't go copying from Serebii and would need to research this further, but I've yet to see a single Pokémon that contradicts his list), though aside from that we seem to have it all there. As we can see, this means that plenty of Pokémon don't appear here and, as I keep droning on about, not listing it is inconsistent with the way the wiki is with providing comprehensive information on articles. - Blazios _talk 17:12, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

Replying to Schiffy: I'm not there yet, so I did not know that. This is very interesting.

Otherwise I am backing what Blazios said. There is nothing comprehensive about excluding information on where Pokémon can be caught from their respective articles. CycloneGU (talk) 20:33, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

Tiddlywinks brought up a great point that I hadn't considered. The Friend Safari mechanic is very similar to the White Forest wild Pokémon. We should handle them both the same way. I would rather we list these Pokémon on both pages, but I also understand that we shouldn't let appearances in the Friend Safari stop the Pokémon from being considered version-exclusive. --SnorlaxMonster 08:28, 20 November 2013 (UTC)

Any word on this? I've lost count of the amount of people who've tried to add this information to articles, assuming that we'd forgotten to add it. Unless someone wants to add a notice to the page of every single Pokémon that can be found in the Friend Safari, saying to not put that it can be found in the Friend Safari for some reason (in which case, why not spend the time adding the information to the articles). I still don't see the logic in not guaranteed to get=does not exist. - Blazios _talk 13:55, 25 November 2013 (UTC)

Berrenta (and possibly others? but as far as I've noticed, mostly Berrenta) is continually removing these Friend Safari entries, but we have no solid consensus on this page, and in fact, the only admin to post here (SnorlaxMonster) just said we should handle them like White Forest — i.e., list them. What are we gonna do? Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 20:03, 25 November 2013 (UTC)

I was removing because there's no guarantee a certain Pokémon will appear, like Stratelier mentioned earlier. If we are going to list Friend Safaris eventually, I'll be fine with that; I can always undo my own edits if needed. However, I'd suggest that if we are listing it, then it should have its own section of the template (like Dream World and Pal Park). For now, I can hold off the notices I was placing until there's a consensus. Berrenta (talk) 20:16, 25 November 2013 (UTC)

So what if there's no guarantee that the Pokémon will appear. By not saying that it can be found in the Friend Safari, it's like saying "this Pokémon can't be found in this game at all", which is wrong and misleading. It should be mentioned that it can be found in the Friend Safari. If someone doesn't understand the mechanics of the Friend Safari and doesn't know why they can't find that Pokémon, they can just read the page on it, which will be linked. If someone wants a Pokémon badly enough, they could keep adding friends until they find a Safari with that Pokémon and maybe even keep adding friends until they get all the Pokémon available. It should be mentioned on Pokémon pages that they can be found here. I feel that even if they are found elsewhere in the game, it should be mentioned too. It's an in-game location for the Pokémon and it's important. ☆The Solar Dragon☆ 20:40, 25 November 2013 (UTC)

You have a valid point there, Solar Dragon. I think we should bring this to a poll, either here or in the forums, so we all can decide who's in favor. Berrenta (talk) 20:59, 25 November 2013 (UTC)

I've made a thread here. There's not a poll because I dislike polls and prefer discussion. --SnorlaxMonster 04:46, 26 November 2013 (UTC)

(resetting indent) I know I responded.... but it looks like the post was never approved.... Schiffy (Speak to me|What I've done) 04:23, 27 November 2013 (UTC)

Has anyone found Pokémon like Ratatta, which has not been listed? If not, then I think it should be a reason for listing Friend Safari in articles of Pokémon that can be found. Unless it is proven that every Pokémon can be found in the Friend Safari, it is best to list the Friend Safari in the game data. It isn't looking like Pal Park or Trading where you can get any Pokémon. It looks like just another area to find some Pokémon. SeanWheeler (talk) 00:48, 2 December 2013 (UTC)

Combining the data from the forums, this section, and the section below gives us a current tally. Note: The following is an assumption of the opinions that have been stated. --Super goku (talk) 06:09, 18 December 2013 (UTC)

The users who have currently shown support for listing are User:SnorlaxMonster, User:Berrenta, User:Blazios, User:Tiddlywinks, User:Soulweaver, User:Spriteit, User:Maverick Nate/, User:Schiffy, User:CycloneGU,
The users who have shown some support for listing in specific cases are User:Schiffy, User:Solar Dragon, User:Crystal Talian (See here), User:Pokemaster97, User:Jo The Marten (See here), User:SeanWheeler, User:Chosen of Mana, User:Luna Tiger/, User:Pumpkinking0192
The users who are opposed for listing are User:Stratelier
I am unsure of the opinion of User:Muur

So with that tally and only one person opposing, can we please list Friend Safari? Now? There is no point in omitting it, especially when everyone has agreed to list it. SeanWheeler (talk) 18:12, 21 December 2013 (UTC)

Ok, I think we should put on Pokemon that can be caught in the Friend Safari that they can be caught in the Friend Safari. It would be less confusing for some people I guess. AwesomeGrovyle (talk) 19:59, 21 December 2013 (UTC)

We should be able to list it soon, but we haven't been able to come to a clear decision on how to display it. From my guess nine are for the current idea, while nine others have a different idea. That would be the next thing to debate it would seem. --Super goku (talk) 03:49, 22 December 2013 (UTC)

I still slightly prefer displaying it a la the Dream World in part because that seems like the simplest way (given our current templates) to display Pokémon that are version-exclusive outside FS but appear in both versions in FS. I have, however, seen a lot of logical arguments on the forum for displaying it a la White Forest, and I've been kind of convinced by the logical reasoning behind it, even if I'm doubtful about how clear the execution will be. Above all, I think the primary goal should be for version exclusivity to be completely clear and unambiguous. If that's accomplished, I don't care about the details of how we display it. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 04:07, 22 December 2013 (UTC)

Taking the example of the odd, almost-version-exclusive that is Petilil, you should be able to do something like this for (e.g.) Swirlix.

This Pokémon was unavailable prior to Generation VI.

Generation VI

X

Y

Uncommon^X Friend Safari	Route 7^X Fairy-type Safari Slot 2

That seems clear enough to me. (I don't suppose that "Fairy-type Safari Slot 2" is the absolute best thing to have in there. Someone can probably think of something better.) Tiddlywinks (talk) 05:27, 22 December 2013 (UTC)

Honest opinion, I would just make "Slot 2" into {{tt}} text. (Fairy-type Safari) --Super goku (talk) 05:34, 22 December 2013 (UTC)

There seems to be only 11 version exclusives in the Friend Safari: Throh, Sawk, Manectric, Pupitar, Cloyster, Pinsir, Heracross, Mightyena, Liepard, Spritzee and Swirlix. Whoa, looks like the version-exclusives would be reduced to half. But we can still put a note listing the version exclusives that appear in the Friend Safari on the version exclusives page. You guys are making it harder than it should. Just because some version exclusives can be found in the Friend Safari in both versions? The Caterpie and Weedle lines would have been version exclusives in Johto if it weren't for that Bug-Catching Contest. And Latias roams Hoenn in Sapphire and Kanto in HeartGold, while Latios roams Hoenn in Ruby and Kanto in SoulSilver. However, they can be caught in each other's game by an event item. And I don't think Friend Safari should be a special rarity. I think the Pokémon found there should be just considered rare. I really think Friend Safari should just be treated as well as any location. It is not a way to transfer Pokémon from previous games like Pal Park or an external thing like Dream World or the Pokéwalker. It is a legimate in-game way of getting Pokémon. You just need a Friend Code to enter. And that Friend doesn't necessarily have to have the Pokémon found in his/her Safari or agree to link with you. And while it is random, less than a third of the 718 Pokémon can be found in there. Others like Rattata can't be obtained. While I might be fine with having the asterisks, maybe put the type in the asterisk too, unless it is a single-typed, the type of Safari would be obvious. Although, Cascoon is found in the Poison type Safari even though it is a pure Bug type. SeanWheeler (talk) 17:12, 22 December 2013 (UTC)

I like the idea of "Friend Safari" having its own segment. I don't think "Slot 1" or "Slot 2", etc. are necessary, though for Slot 3 you might want to note that the Pokémon can only be found in a Safari belonging to someone who finished the game. No other notes regarding slots are necessary.

I have more thoughts but am on the way out for the evening. I'll post more another time. Happy holidays! CycloneGU (talk) 21:20, 24 December 2013 (UTC)

Well I have not attended this conversation in forever, but currently I'm not universally against listing Pokemon as available in the Friend Safari (people are right: it is valid and useful information, especially for species that in XY only appear in the Friend Safari), just against listing it as the only place if there's a more direct way to obtain that species. The specific example that prompted my post was seeing Fletchinder's page list only the Friend Safari as an in-game location, when it's clear that the player is more likely to actually obtain a Fletchinder by evolving a Fletchling (who is readily obtained in the Kalos wild). Pokemon species locations are generally listed starting from the "earliest" location/method they can be obtained in the given game, so if a page lists only the Friend Safari (or a trade) as a location, this presents an implication that it cannot be caught or obtained earlier than that, which in Fletchinder's case is obviously not true. --Stratelier 07:28, 4 February 2014 (UTC)

The admins have already made the decision to include the Friend Safari. It's just taking awhile to get the templates properly put together to accommodate it. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 16:50, 5 February 2014 (UTC)

Reply regarding Contest and Lati - it's because, unlike Friend Safari, they're set and the same for every player. Friend Safari, on other hand, is all but fixed. Eridanus (talk) 17:03, 5 February 2014 (UTC)

Finding the type based on Friend Code

So, it's clear that the type of a certain person's Friend Safari is based on their System's Friend Code, but what I'm curious to find out is if someone can find exactly how this is done. I could imagine the calculation isn't a world different from calculating whether a Pokémon will be Shiny based on its personality value or similar equations that have been used in games past. But if anyone can find it, it would be a useful addition to the article. Schiffy (Speak to me|What I've done) 20:21, 25 October 2013 (UTC)

Spreadsheet

This spreadsheet may assist you in figuring out what you have and don't have out of the Friend Safari. Tell me if you have any comments/suggestions/questions!

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B4hK...?usp=drive_web

Download away! (.xlsx) - unsigned comment from Namelessdeath (talk • contribs)

Friend Codes and Friend Safari Areas

Should we have separate Sub-Pages, or just somewhere on the page, to add Friend Codes for various different types so that we can add the type we want.--Tom (My Talk Page) 22:11, 29 October 2013 (UTC)

Explaining how a friend code determines what type is in each person's Friend Safari is fine. Listing people's friend codes, or trading friend codes is something that's better left to the forums. --It's Funktastic~!_{話してください} 22:17, 29 October 2013 (UTC)

I think if someone is willing to offer theirs for examples sake so we can figure out the relation, it might be okay to add.... Schiffy (Speak to me|What I've done) 02:43, 30 October 2013 (UTC)

Coming back to this, I've tried different manners of calculations combining XORs and Modulo 18s to see where it gets me, using the codes I have registered and the types they match up to. I've come up with no ascertainable pattern. If we can get a single forum thread going dedicated to finding the key with people who would, again, be willing to offer their codes for testing purposes, we just might get somewhere. Schiffy (Speak to me|What I've done) 20:18, 1 November 2013 (UTC)

Actually, when the Join Avenue was new, we did do something like this to get the data. I do not see the harm in pooling the data so long as everyone is alright with it. Otherwise we could just make a section for the sum of a Friend Code as AAAA-BBBB-CCCC and seeing if we can figure it out with only the sums of section A, B, and C. --Super goku (talk) 06:09, 18 December 2013 (UTC)

IVs

Every pokemon I catch here has 2 random perfect IVs of 31. I don't think it's just me, it's gotta be a fact and worth sharing. DuelKING (talk) 19:36, 7 November 2013 (UTC)DuelKINGDuelKING (talk) 19:36, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

I can confirm this one (aside from the fact that Serebii had it, I've tested it plenty of times myself). What I've also noticed, but I'm not sure if this is an always, but two Pokémon in a row that I caught in the Safari also had two random really low IVs (the calculators I used all gave me 0-3 at Level 30 with no EVs, and I would not be surprised if they turned out to be just 0). Schiffy (Speak to me|What I've done) 19:43, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

The Pokemon always having two perfect IVs is true. The other part, having two really low IVs is not. Also, the IV checker in Kiloude's Pokemon Center will also tell you if they have 0 IVs. --It's Funktastic~!_{話してください} 19:45, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

To build on this, it seems that the game will allow for three or more perfect IVs by chance, so I doubt there are stats forced lower by the Friend Safari. --Super goku (talk) 23:44, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

However, why doesn't the IVs show in super training? Superbobbobbob3 (talk) 15:06, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

Based on data I've seen from Friend Safari users in the chat room, most Pokémon run through the bot command !piv from the Safari tend to have three perfect IVs suggested, even though without training which three cannot be confirmed. Also, a few of these Pokémon have higher IVs in the ones that are not perfect, so the others are not necessarily lower. I'll have access to my Safari soon (which I've been told is Ghost, I have no idea why I got stuck with that) and I plan to catch some Pokémon and see what kind of numbers I end up with. CycloneGU (talk) 04:32, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

Er, it's actually extremely easy to see which IVs are perfect without any training whatsoever. The IV guy is in the Pokemon Center in the same town, and he mentions every perfect IV. And having access to mine, it's a complete crapshoot whether the other IVs are good or not. I've had good to perfect in the others, and IVs that were 0. --It's Funktastic~!_{話してください} 04:36, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

Yeah, I'm not there yet, so I keep forgetting that guy is there. I'll catch up soon. I have been taking my time trying to get data for the Wiki and not actually speeding through the game. I do have access to Victory Road but have yet to visit. CycloneGU (talk) 04:57, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

Shiny Pokémon Chance Increased

I have noticed that various places have said that have found a shiny pokemon very easy in the friend safari (Clamed to be a 1/300 chance and in the friend safari it takes a lest 24 minuets to find one and five hours at the most.). This is some we should test out - unsigned comment from Superbobbobbob3 (talk • contribs)

names

I have noticed that the list with your friends on it will sometimes have different names on it than the ones used in their games. Where does the safari get your friends names from? - unsigned comment from Auragirl (talk • contribs)

The names used in the Friend Safari match the names of the Mii on the 3DS corresponding to that person's code, rather than their X/Y character name. Schiffy (Speak to me|What I've done) 15:32, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

Hidden Abilities

From my own experience, Pokémon cannot be found with their Hidden Ability unless that Trainer has 3 Pokémon available (so has defeated the Champion then been online at the same time as you). I am weary about adding this though, as it is only from empirical tests, and is not conclusively known. It's very easy to falsify, not so easy to prove. If anyone has found a Pokémon with its Hidden Ability in the Friend Safari with only 2 Pokémon, please reply here. --SnorlaxMonster 08:16, 20 November 2013 (UTC)

I can test this. I have a large number of friends with only two Pokémon (not playing in other words) and am cruising around Safaris right now. If I get any hidden abilities I'll update with all details except for the user info (obviously). Meanwhile, the infobox is oddly stretched on the page; not sure if this can be fixed? CycloneGU (talk) 16:35, 24 November 2013 (UTC)

Hidden Abilities are available if both people have been online in-game at the same time. If the character's silhouette has changed from ? to their in-game character portrait, then there's a chance for HAs to be obtained. I currently have at least one Safari where all 3 are available, but no HAs, and several where only 2 mons are available, but they're available with HAs. I've updated the relevant section with the correct information. Tathra (talk) 01:30, 23 February 2014 (UTC)

The way Tathra describes it here, it sounds like HAs are only obtainable while two players are online at the same time. However, SnorlaxMonster just changed it so that it sounds more like all that's needed to unlock the possibility of HAs is for the players to be online together once. Like, I could get online with a friend, save, then reset my game and play completely offline, and I'd still have a chance to find HAs in that friend's Friend Safari. Is that right? (This is what I assumed in the "massaging" I just did.) Tiddlywinks (talk) 02:52, 23 February 2014 (UTC)

Tathra described it as both players having been online at the same time at some point, not currently being online at that time. The player silhouette changes once the players have been online at the same time, not while they are currently both online. You are correct in your second statement. --SnorlaxMonster 02:55, 23 February 2014 (UTC)

Ah, I mistook the meaning of the "?". I thought it was for a friend who's offline; I forgot they just have their picture dimmed down. So that made some of the rest of the wording seem to be at odds to me, too. Thanks. Tiddlywinks (talk) 03:02, 23 February 2014 (UTC)

The main part I'm trying to correct is that both players dont have to be online at the same time for the 3rd mon to be available. They likely have to have their 3ds online at the same time for the information to be passed that yes, this player has defeated the E4 and Champion (similar to how Streetpassing works - you dont have to be playing a game right then in order to use its streetpass fuction), but getting the 3rd slot does not require that both players be online in the game at the same time. In this picture you can see that all 3 mons are available, but the players image is just a silhouette with ?, meaning that I cant get HAs, because we have not been online in-game at the same time. If being online in-game at the same time was a requirement for the 3rd mon to be available, this situation would not be possible. Tathra (talk) 03:18, 23 February 2014 (UTC)

I see. I'd really like to be able to say whether the 3DS/game can just pull the information out of "thin air" or whether you both have to have your 3DSs online at the same time, but in the absence of that knowledge, I suppose I'll leave it as is, for people to work out on their own. If that's not been updated before I meander my way to the end of the game, I'll have to find someone to test that requirement with. Tiddlywinks (talk) 03:47, 23 February 2014 (UTC)

It'll be a hassle to orchestrate with somebody to have their 3ds offline after they add you, and to make sure neither of you are online at the same time. The easiest way to test it would be to have two 3dses. My money is on both people needing their 3dses connected to wifi at the same time for just a second, but its possible that the flag, if it exists at that time, is sent along with the confirmation that they've also added you as a friend. At any rate, it might not be necessary to state that both 3dses must be online at some point because its not really something you need to try to make happen. Tathra (talk) 04:33, 23 February 2014 (UTC)

I'm not really sure what you're thinking, above. What I want to know is what it takes for someone who sees a Friend Safari with two Pokemon to see that FS with three Pokemon once the other player has beaten the Elite Four. To set it up is easy: before I get to the Elite Four, I just need to become friends with someone(s), so they've got my Friend Safari with only two Pokemon in it. (I've actually already got a couple, now that I think about it. =P ) Then I'll beat the Elite Four and...I guess I'll try to connect online (just with my 3DS, while my game is not running) for a minute or two while they're not online. I'll see if that's possibly enough to let them see the third Pokemon the next time they connect online (while I'm offline); if not, then we can just try to be online (without our games - or mine at least - running) at the same time. QED Tiddlywinks (talk) 04:50, 23 February 2014 (UTC)

Lapras and Shuppet

Can someone confirm if Lapras and Shuppet are available via Water and Ghost Safaris, respectively?

Katrinuh (talk) 00:47, 25 November 2013 (UTC)

I can confirm Shuppet. --Wynd Fox 04:13, 25 November 2013 (UTC)

I can confirm Lapras, but it is available in an Ice Safari, not a Water Safari. Plumbgirlie (talk) 00:26, 24 February 2014 (UTC)

Not Listing in Avaliblity

According to this edit, the wiki isn't listing Friend Safari. If no one minds me asking, why not? Tacopill (talk) 22:31, 25 November 2013 (UTC)

Still discussing it. Not came to a conclusion. Look above, at the huge discussion. ☆The Solar Dragon☆ 22:35, 25 November 2013 (UTC)

I hope we get a clear decision soon. I really don't like removing the Friend Safari listings, to be honest. Many of us have voiced our opinions on the matter. Berrenta (talk) 22:45, 25 November 2013 (UTC)

So if you personally don't like removing it, why do it? It makes you look like you are supporting the removal of Friend Safari entries. SeanWheeler (talk) 00:51, 2 December 2013 (UTC)

It's not because I support them. To be honest, I don't. It was only because there was the ongoing debate, and they didn't want it listed until a decision was made. Berrenta (talk) 00:58, 2 December 2013 (UTC)

Shinies

Really, is there any way to determine whether or not the chances are higher than normal? It seems like lots of people have found shinies here (I found a shiny Boldore my first time in), which may or may not be significant? Is hacking necessary for numbers? -- Pringles 05:33, 26 November 2013 (UTC)

The shiny rate has apparently been doubled throughout the entire game, not just in the Friend Safari. See our Shiny Pokémon article. Pumpkinking0192 (talk) 05:37, 26 November 2013 (UTC)

(Six months is the limit, right?) Even taking the doubled rate through the entire game into consideration, the reports I've seen seem to have much higher rates than 1/4096, and this doesn't seem to just be a few people, either (it's happened to some friends, too). But, unless I'm missing something, would the only reliable way to confirm this be hacking? -- EnosShayrem _talk 03:18, 4 March 2014 (UTC)

Yeah, but those high rates would be due to the Shiny Charm. --SnorlaxMonster 13:34, 21 March 2014 (UTC)

The article says there is an increased chance, has this finally been verified? Yamitora1 (talk) 03:41, 16 April 2014 (UTC)

Like it says in the history. Tiddlywinks (talk) 04:06, 16 April 2014 (UTC)

Can we really say Smogon's independent research is a reliable source? '~' Me, Hurray! (talk) 13:49, 25 April 2014 (UTC)

Alot of Smogon's research is trusted here, given that, if I recall the reason correctly, while they may be a fan site, they often do conduct in-depth accurate research with more than enough proof to back it up. A staff member could explain it better than me, though. Schiffy (瀬藤健二) (Talk Contribs) 13:53, 4/25/2014 (UTC)

It's a darn sight better than purely subjective anecdotes, that's for sure. I'm happy to bet on the likelihood that someone actually gathered real data for that over the possibility that someone faked it all. You can always feel free to try to convince me (/Bulbapedia) I'm wrong, though. Tiddlywinks (talk) 00:53, 26 April 2014 (UTC)

JP Guidebook info

Type	Slot 1	Slot 2	Slot 3
Normal	Lillipup, Dunsparce, Teddiursa, Aipom	Kecleon, Minccino, Loudred, Audino	Eevee, Ditto, Smeargle, Chansey
Fire	Ponyta, Growlithe, Pansear, Magmar	Charmeleon, Pyroar, Slugma, Larvesta	Braixen, Braixen, Fletchinder, Ninetales
Water	Krabby, Bibarel, Panpour, Octillery	Wartortle, Quagsire, Gyarados, Flowsel	Frogadier, Frogadier, Azumarill, Poliwhirl
Grass	Oddish, Tangela, Pansage, Sunkern	Ivysaur, Petilil, Sawsbuck, Swadloon	Quilladin, Quilladin, Maractus, Gogoat
Electric	Electrode, Emolga, Dedenné, Pachirisu	Pikachu, Helioptile, Electabuzz, Stunfisk	Luxio, Galvantula, Zebstrika, Manectric
Ice	Snorunt, Delibird, Spheal, Snover	Bergmite, Bergmite, Sneasel, Beartic	Lapras, Cloyster, Dewgong, Piloswine
Fighting	Meditite, Mankey, Machoke, Mienfoo	Pancham, Pancham, Throh, Sawk	Hariyama, Tyrogue, Riolu, Breloom
Poison	Kakuna, Cascoon, Seviper, Gloom	Venomoth, Swalot, Garbodour, Ariados	Toxicroak, Drapion, Muk, Whirlipede
Ground	Phanpy, Wooper, Trapinch, Sandshrew	Marowak, Camerupt, Dugtrio, Nincada	Palpitoad, Gastrodon, Diggersby, Diggersby
Flying	Pidgey, Spearow, Farfetch'd, Doduo	Hoothoot, Tranquill, Swanna, Woobat	Rufflet, Tropius, Fletchinder, Hawlucha
Psychic	Abra, Drowzee, Grumpig, Munna	Wobbuffet, Sigilyph, Espurr, Espurr	Duosion, Xatu, Girafarig, Gothorita
Bug	Butterfree, Combee, Lediba, Paras	Beautifly, Masquerain, Volbeat, Illumise	Vivillon, Venomoth, Pinsir, Heracross
Rock	Dwebble, Dwebble, Nosepass, Boldore	Pipitar, Corsola, Onix, Magcargo	Rhydon, Shuckle, Barbaracle, Barbaracle
Ghost	Shuppet, Shuppet, Lampent, Lampent	Phantump, Phantump, Pumpkaboo, Pumpkaboo	Golurk, Drifblim, Dusclops, Spiritomb
Dragon	Gabite, Gabite, Fraxure, Fraxure	Shelgon, Dragonair, Noibat, Noibat	Druddigon, Druddigon, Sliggoo, Sliggoo
Dark	Pawniard, Vullaby, Nuzleaf, Mightyena	Sneasel, Sandile, Cacturne, Crawdaunt	Liepard, Inkay, Absol, Sableye
Steel	Ferroseed, Ferroseed, Mawile, Magneton	Metang, Klang, Skarmory, Forretress	Bronzong, Excadrill, Klefki, Klefki
Fairy	Kirlia, Snubbull, Togepi, Dedenné	Mawile, Jigglypuff, Spritzee, Swirlix	Floette (Red), Clefairy, Floette (Yellow), Floette (Blue)

Slot 3 Pokemon will only appear if the registered friend has entered the Hall of Fame.

Hidden Abilities will only appear if the registered friend has entered the Hall of Fame.

Each choice in a slot has a 25% chance, so if something appears twice, it has a 50% chance.

All listings are in the exact order they appear in the book.

Hopefully this helps. Bluesun (talk) 02:27, 2 December 2013 (UTC)

Yeah, it does help. Especially in the argument on whether or not to list the Friend Safari. SeanWheeler (talk) 21:36, 2 December 2013 (UTC)

This certainly seems like it should be added, but I'm wondering if at least one or two other people can confirm all of this to be safe. Schiffy (Speak to me|What I've done) 22:11, 2 December 2013 (UTC)

Noticed the above table was worked in the page, and it looks great! I also agree with Sean: hopefully it can help us settle the debate. Berrenta (talk) 22:53, 2 December 2013 (UTC)

Any objections to from the opposition? Or should we go ahead and add Friend Safari to the appropriate Pokémon? SeanWheeler (talk) 23:22, 3 December 2013 (UTC)

I would say at this point, several days later, that there's no remaining opposition. I say be bold and go ahead, and if it gets reverted refer that user here to explain why they disagree. CycloneGU (talk) 08:30, 8 December 2013 (UTC)

Well, Pokemaster has stopped me, and we're getting a debate on my talk page. It's still not over yet. And I'm really annoyed that even with this set list, there are still people who don't want it. We're lying of omission when we don't include the Friend Safari on the Pokémon pages. SeanWheeler (talk) 23:16, 9 December 2013 (UTC)

Maybe we can include a "post-game" tag, to say it is not available there until after beating the game? Tacopill (talk) 23:50, 9 December 2013 (UTC)

(resetting indent) Honestly, if people would pay attention, there has been a thread going for a while created by SnorlaxMonster. It's going to be far easier in the long run than arguing on 3 or more talk pages here. Schiffy (Speak to me|What I've done) 02:53, 10 December 2013 (UTC)

Well, no one has replied to my last comment on that forum and I was asking how it can be decided. SeanWheeler (talk) 04:04, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

Side note: I'm not a member of the forum and really think all conversations regarding the Wiki should happen ON THE WIKI. And I still believe we need to have all Pokémon that CAN be found noted as such. CycloneGU (talk) 02:56, 18 December 2013 (UTC)

Schiffy, you replied to this very topic on the 2nd. This was about the JP Guidebook and turned into a discussion on whether to include this or not. I will admit that these discussion should be tied into each other, which I have attempted to do. --Super goku (talk) 06:09, 18 December 2013 (UTC)

Post-Christmas Update on This?

Pokémon Bank releases today, so no matter what, all 718 currently known Pokémon can be moved into X/Y today. However, we still haven't settled the native issue of Friend Safari. The linked thread above has had no commentary since December 14. I think the time has come to be bold and make the changes. We also must maintain a central place ON THIS WIKI for anyone who still objects to be referred to to explain their reasons. The point I'm making is there is no objective reason that the information found CANNOT be included, so it's time to include it; the only thing to debate is how to make that information look in the end. And that we can continue to debate. It's time to add the information. CycloneGU (talk) 19:19, 27 December 2013 (UTC)

Actually it was delayed due to problems with the eshop network, so currently only Pokémon from Kalos, Friend Safari and the few that were traded up in Japan before it was taken down are actually available--Ditto51/Tom (My Talk Page) 20:17, 27 December 2013 (UTC).

All right, so Bank got delayed. We still need to decide the Friend Safari thing, and soon. CycloneGU (talk) 20:05, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

It has pretty much been decided that we will be including it. Kogoro has been working diligently on a revamp of the Availability template in order to include the Friend Safari. Unfortunately, we can't simply snap our fingers and have all the information added instantly. It's important that this is done the correct way. Due to some unforeseen issues with the revamped template, it hasn't been implemented yet. We will be adding in Friend Safari in due time. Thank you for bearing with us so far, but I must ask you to be patient for just a bit longer as the template is worked out. ^Maverick _Nate 20:30, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

No problem, issues with the template is something I can understand. The problem will be fixed in due time and the information added. After all, there is no deadline for a Wiki. =) CycloneGU (talk) 20:53, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

Good to hear there's a plan to incorporate Friend Safari. As long as the kinks are ironed out, we should be fine. The potential revamp looks pretty good so far. Berrenta (talk) 22:26, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

It's been two more months now. I understand that the Editorial Board had some restructuring or whatever and that could be a factor in the continued delay. But I'd just like an update.

Maverick Nate said above that there were some unforeseen issues with the revamped template, but Kogoro doesn't seem to have made any (significant) changes to it since that comment. Could someone elaborate on those issues? Perhaps someone else can contribute a solution. As it is, I don't even know why Friend Safari locations can't just be added to the current template immediately (in one format or another)... Tiddlywinks (talk) 15:59, 7 March 2014 (UTC)

Well, it seems we got the new availability template worked out, and we are finally listing Friend Safari. It's good we finally got it going. I saw the new template as it was being incorporated, and it looks a little better than what we had before. Berrenta (talk) 19:16, 24 March 2014 (UTC)

Location column

Is the Location Column really necessary, it seems a little redundant and pointless. All there is in the safari is grass, so it goes without saying where to find the Pokémon. Yamitora1 (talk) 09:05, 13 January 2014 (UTC)

You wouldn't be wrong, really, to argue that it is unnecessary, but it's also not really worth doing the work to remove that column either. The template currently being used is entirely sufficient and by no means egregiously bad, to need any "fixing". Tiddlywinks (talk) 09:18, 13 January 2014 (UTC)

This by far isn't the only location in the games with only one way of finding wild Pokémon, another example in the same games is Route 2, which also only has grass. As Tiddlywinks stated, there's no need to go messing with the entire template or using an entire different one for this location because of such a small factor. Schiffy (瀬藤健二) (Talk Contribs) 16:56,1/13/2014 (UTC)

Hidden Ability chances

For an offline friend I found that the chances to get the HA for Pokémon with 3 Abilities available is of 1/3rd. Sample is small (n=300) but the results are almost consistent with a distribution of 1:1:1. Results were:

1st Ability: 102
2nd Ability: 97
Hid Ability: 101

I'll test the distribution for an online friend as soon as I can contact my best friend. We may be able to get a bigger sample and debunk or confirm that thing about HAs being more common when the owner of the safari is online. --Profesor Rod (talk) 04:46, 24 February 2014 (UTC)

To be honest, this really doesn't surprise me all too much. Gen VI, from what I've seen, has taken what used to be "Hidden Abilities" and made them far far more common, essentially no more than a second or third (species dependent) regularly-obtainable Ability, the only exception maybe being when you obtain the starters (yet breeding seems to give about a 50/50 chance from what I've seen on videos). If I were to hazard a guess, the online results, if you get around to testing them, probably won't be too different. Schiffy (瀬藤健二) (Talk Contribs) 07:07, 2/24/2014 (UTC)

Encounter Rate

I tackled this question pretty much like the Hidden Abilities one, but this is faster to test since I don't need to wait for all those Trace messages. Still, there is a lot of statistical noise on each individual run but, assuming that encounter rates are the same no matter the safari's type, by seeing the whole sample it's pretty much a 1:1:1 distribution:

Normal: Aipom:33 Loudred:33 Ditto:34
Dragon: Fraxure:36 Dragonair:33 Sliggoo:31
Fighting: Mienfoo:65 Pancham:61 Riolu:74
Ice: Spheal:60 Bergmite:71 Piloswine:69
Total: Slot1:194 Slot2:198 Slot3:208

Just for completeness sake I quickly checked safari with only 2 Pokémon and got:

Water: Panpour:29 Floatzel:21
Poison: Seviper:26 Garbodor:24
Rock: Dwebble:26 Corsola:24
Psychic: Munna:19 Espurr:31
Total: Slot1:100 Slot2:100

There might be something in this last one, but with such a small sample I can't tell. An educated guess suggest a 1:1 distribution too but I'm not very interested in producing more data since most people go for the fully unlocked safaris. --Profesor Rod (talk) 11:09, 24 February 2014 (UTC)

On to something about what the Friend Code determines

I think I am on to something about how a players friend code effects the type of Friend Safari and the pokemon that appear. I have gotten good consistencies from a FS FC trading forum and a few quirks that I hope are just typos on the forum.

I would like to eventually share this information and even write a program that does this but I have a feeling it will take a while. Jmsnipes100 (talk) 04:41, 10 March 2014 (UTC)

Sneasle the only Pokémon found in two types of Safari?

I was searching a Ice Safari, and it had a Sneasle, I then went to a Dark Safari, it has a Sneasle as well. I looked up and down, and unless I missed it Sneasle seems to be the only Pokémon that appears in more than one type of Safari. Its almost 5am here, having a bout of insomnia but (I am more than tired, I just can't get to sleep for some reason) so its highly possible I am missing any other Pokémon that might be in another safari. Yamitora1 (talk) 08:54, 21 March 2014 (UTC)

Fletchinder and Venomoth. glik^glak 12:29, 21 March 2014 (UTC)

Move to trivia

SHouldnt that part about it being the place were evos of starters can be caught be in the trivia? or is it just to importent. Pokemonisawesome2 (talk) 04:20, 16 August 2014 (UTC)

Online to unlock third slot

I know the other person has to have beaten the E4 and come online to unlock the 3rd slot, but do they have to use XY or can it be ORAS? Yamitora1 (talk) 03:16, 17 July 2015 (UTC)

Hidden Abilities Error

So, I have been avidly trying to catch a Scrappy Pancham for at least an hour now. I've battled way more than what would be acceptable error for a 1/3 odds or even some dumb odds like 1/20. I do not believe you only need the other player to have been online for hidden abilities to appear. I'm not sure what other special case is apparent here; the friend safari I'm using has been online when I was (portrait change and all), but not defeated the Elite Four. Basically, I think this needs to be reopened if possible; simply stating you just need the other player to have been online is simply untrue. Trainer Samothy (talk) 01:45, 31 August 2015 (UTC)

According to #Talk:Friend_Safari#JP_Guidebook_info, the Japanese guidebook says the requirement for both is that the friend has entered the Hall of Fame. Another user above claims that they found Pokémon with their HA while only 2 were available, but considering this evidence, I'm doubting that now. --SnorlaxMonster 02:03, 31 August 2015 (UTC)

Safari/Friend names

This page should mention how the Friend Safaris are named. Right now it's not really and it's very easy to make the wrong assumption.

The name shown for the Friend Safari from a given friend code matches the name that appears in the 3DS's friend list for that friend code—it does not use the player's in-game name. The thing is, I'm not sure if that name is something like your Nintendo Network ID, or what; or if (and/or how) that can change. If someone can determine those things, this info should be edited in. Tiddlywinks (talk) 19:18, 1 November 2015 (UTC)

Problem with HA requirement

One way or another, we seem to have a problem with the requirement for Hidden Abilities. Currently we just say if you and your friend have been on the PSS together, you can get HAs. But that's not my experience.

I started a new game on a JP 3DS and when I added the FCs of both my 3DSs to each other, I couldn't find HAs on my NA 3DS. I ran through a JP Y game, and after each Badge I connected to the PSS (over the Internet), and for at least 50 encounters each time, I never saw an HA on the NA 3DS, until after I entered the Hall of Fame in the JP Y game. (A possible caveat, for somewhere after the 1st Badge and up to the 8th Badge, I actually did all of that on the same day. Unfortunately, the date rolled over just before I could connect after entering the Hall of Fame. So for all I know, maybe something didn't get a chance to "update".)

I also experienced the same issue with another user, who only had 4 Badges in XY (and had a NA 3DS, and I was on my NA 3DS); we were absolutely on the PSS together, but I couldn't find any HAs in about 100 encounters.

Just to check, does anyone out there have a Safari with only 2 slots unlocked where they can actually get HAs?

Also, if anyone has a game (ORAS works fine too) where they haven't entered the Hall of Fame and you want to send me your Friend Code (on the forums if you want), maybe we can try to see if it's only a problem for certain users, somehow. And/or, I'll send you my FC for a game that hasn't entered the Hall of Fame, and you can see for yourself if there are HAs or not.

One last thing: can anyone with a guidebook that discusses the Friend Safari check/snap a pic of what (if anything) it says about unlocking HAs?

Tiddlywinks (talk) 01:34, 4 January 2016 (UTC)

Shiny chance change

I have problems understanding why the statement about the shiny chance (-> In the games) was changed. the reference given and removed doesn't seem to state the chance anywhere (unless I missed it, I haven't checked every single place), and Smogon's research states quite a clear 1/512 chance. can anyone confirm anything? Erezushi (talk) 18:35, 8 May 2018 (UTC)

Edit: I have found the statement of the chances, but it seems random and without ant proof behind them, I'm still looking for an answer. Erezushi (talk) 18:50, 8 May 2018 (UTC)

Ummmmm...Smogon is a fan site. We aren't allowed to use those unless they give permission and show their non-original research-based sources. Look somewhere else for answers and please site yours that aren't fansites...--BlisseyandtheAquaJets (talk) 18:54, 8 May 2018 (UTC)

Wasn't Smogon the previous source for this info? besides, looking all over the internet, I'm only seeing the same 1/512. What I'm trying to understand is why it was even changed in the first place, after it said the same thing for over 4.5 years. Erezushi (talk) 19:43, 9 May 2018 (UTC)

Because something better was found. A claim doesn't get special treatment just because it's been around for a long time or a lot of people believe it. Tiddlywinks (talk) 00:58, 10 May 2018 (UTC)